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Evoking to
physical appearance study |
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11-05-2004, 11:31 AM |
#1 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Location: Memphis, TN
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Evoking to physical appearance
study
Hi everyone. This is sort of a pet project of mine.
I have never actually gotten around to setting it up and
trying it, but I have researched it
extensively.
What I know so far
is:
Replacing the triangle with the pentacle is
required for certain ops.
If enough sacrifice is
provided, the intelligence can manifest a body out of
thin air.
A bonfire can serve as a kind of
physical manifestation, though it is not mobile. A
candle flame can similarily be affected, though it will
not show shapes to the extent of a bonfire.
If a
body is provided, and the soul can be pushed out, the
intelligence can snatch it for itself. The soul must
have poor "karma", that is, it must have a great repoire
with the will of the universe to win this battle.
Spirit lights may aid in concentration and
visualization, enough to show a complete neophyte the
phenomena, but it is not actual physical
manifestation.
Share?
LH
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-05-2004, 11:55 AM |
#2 |
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Hangatyr 13 is Offline:
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I don't have much to share, I'm afraid. I've only
recently started researching evocation seriously. What
do you think about using incense to evoke physical
appearance? How about a dead body (not necessarily a
sacrifise if that's what you're thinking). When is
replacing a triangle with a pentacle required?
__________________ "Blood alone. I am the blood of the sword and
the blood of the womb. Into me enter all souls, carried
on the blackened beaks of carrion crows. My ribs are the
bones of the world, bones as purest crystal the color of
spirit. When flesh decays away, only I remain, grim
faced, inviting. Mother of the dead, mother of the
living, with all life drowning in my blood. Drown.
Drown. Drown." -Hela |
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11-05-2004, 01:27 PM |
#3 |
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s_armada is Offline:
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I haven't done a goetic evocation yet. Was going to
on Halloween but felt that I should postpone it because
of the personal breach (aka the incident). Was thinking
of doing it within the next couple of days.
I've
evoked other entities and have noticed that candle
flames are very responsive. I've seen these shoot up to
at least 5" inches and take on a life of their own to
the point where I've used it for divination. Left=yes,
right=no. No draft could do what I've seen. When the
spirits are there, they're THERE. SOmething's there. I
was going to use incense for the evocation (I've seen
THAT do a pretty number). I think a small flame(even 5"
inches is small compared to a bonfire) can show
...character, personality in its movements. But the
incense, although it seems so insubstantial and
ephemeral, can cover more space . I don't know how to
explain this exactly...it's more to work with than a
little flame.
__________________ Why are
you so surprised? What did you think would happen if you
asked Papa Legba to open the doors to the Mysteries for
you? |
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11-05-2004, 04:25 PM |
#4 |
Senior Member
Leviathan is Offline:
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"If a body is provided, and the soul can be pushed
out, the intelligence can snatch it for itself. The soul
must have poor "karma", that is, it must have a great
repoire with the will of the universe to win this
battle."
If you're going to go this route, I
would recommend HIGHLY reading Crowley's "The Bartzabel
Working" in which he evoked Bartzabel within the body of
Neuberg (Fra. Lampada
Tradam) _____________________
You should try
placing blood in the triangle; sacrifice an animal to
the Infernal.
I would choose Blood over Fire for
this Reason: Fire, when inhabited by foreign spirits,
may (as S_Armada claimed) grow in measure-What happens
when an entity successful turns that fire in to a torch
and runs for the walls of your house? (that is, if your
circle is weak)
With blood, if the entity
escapes, the worst it can do is physically attack you
(which I'm not counting off as a mere incident); What I
am saying is, regaining control of your circle after a
physical attack is A LOT easier to do than to run
rampantly after a fire extinguisher-leaving you
distracted of the entity's manifestation-which means it
will, most likely, take advantage of such an
opportunity. ____________________ Mantra: Aum
Ma-ni Pad-me Hum |
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11-05-2004, 09:15 PM |
#5 |
Member
Master of the Abyss is Offline:
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A physical host body can be prepared easily if the
host is willing and able to "let go" (go in a trance).
Even utterly inexperienced people can be hosts if they
can just do this. Given such a host, any preparatory
technique that imprints the unconscious idea of being
vessel-like into the host will do - visualize body made
of hollow, transparent glass, for example. This makes
"poor karma" unneccessary. Certain drugs do help, but
make the exorcising much more
difficult.
Manifestation in smoke works much
better when the room is utterly air-sealed, and the
bigger the room is, the
better. |
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11-05-2004, 09:34 PM |
#6 |
Senior Member
Leviathan is Offline:
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Obviously, this is a few steps above the Beginner.
Caution to those who attempt it! Hydralisk can do
without caution, she's quite adept at this
art.
Question to The Lady H. Which Ritual
Weapon(s) do you use, or will you use (in theory), if a
Spirit escaped the Triangle, and infiltrated your
circle? |
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11-05-2004, 10:34 PM |
#7 |
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NightShade is Offline:
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PhReAkS
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The use of blood, excrement (When applicable) and
other bodily fluids (Semen) is of great use. It has one
special advantage to the operator: It becomes usless
when the body heat is gone (about 15 minutes). This
presents the problem of making the Work time constrained
but guarantees that the manifestation will not last long
enough to do great damage if things go wrong. If someone
can't hold their Will together for about 15 minutes,
they shouldn't attempt this kind of Work.
I know
that the time can be extended with the use of gentle
heat (A candle under the bowl containing the blood).
Still, I advise one to let entropy take it's natural
course with the host (In this example blood) unless
there's dire need for the Entity to have physical form
for an extended amount of time.
Using living
hosts to Invoke the Entity is effective but this
presents dangers of it's own...
Edited to add
that I have had stunning success with inscense as a
means of Appearance. I recommend it as it's "safer" than
many other methods.
...And one more thought: Keep
some Asafoetida around! Tossed on the fire or even
thrown AT a Spirit will disperse it's manifestation.
It's some of the worst smelling stuff around but it's
EFFECTIVE.
__________________
The certainty of
Uncertainty certainly
applies...
As one fey astronomer to another, I bid
you to read the Violet Violence in my eyes and KNOW;
Nice elves do not quitely view their Ego's eclipse while
climbing Qliphotic Trees...
Last edited by NightShade : 11-05-2004 at 10:43 PM. |
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11-05-2004, 10:46 PM |
#8 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 787
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Quote:
Which
Ritual Weapon(s) do you use, or will you use (in
theory), if a Spirit escaped the Triangle, and
infiltrated your circle?
| If it's infiltrated
my circle, then it can do whatever it wants, can't
it....really no time for toys here, if it managed that,
and wanted me dead, it would be
instantaneous. I've had spirits come out of the
triangle, nothing bad ever happened there. Master
of the Abyss, I'm afraid I've just pointed out my
hideous and repulsive character, of course, the subject
could be willing.
Quote:
Hydralisk
can do without caution, she's quite adept at this
art. | Wrong, 
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-05-2004, 11:35 PM |
#9 |
Senior Member
hitman777 is Offline:
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Posts: 756 |
Actually, I've posted on here before about actually
BEING the basis of manifestation for a Sumerian spirit
called Lugulabdubur (from the Simon Nec, can also be
found in the Enuma Elish). I sat in the triangle, and
worked myself into a trance while chanting the spirit's
name while my friend performed the conjurations.
Weird.
__________________ Sorry, I've been away for
awhile. Been experiencing technical difficulties. Will
be posting more frequently once I can get my damned
computer under control! |
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11-07-2004, 03:11 AM |
#10 |
Member
YHVH is Offline:
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Posts: 176 |
Your experience seems to exist no more in OF due to
the hackings. Is it possible to repost it??? |
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11-07-2004, 08:11 AM |
#11 |
Senior Member
Leviathan is Offline:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 635 |
Do it HitMan...Nike: Just Do It. |
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11-07-2004, 10:20 PM |
#12 |
Senior Member
hitman777 is Offline:
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Posts: 756 |
How do I repost it? I don't have it saved or
anything. In fact, I get a little mindboggled by the
ease with which you guys dig up prehack posts. I have no
idea how to do this.
__________________ Sorry, I've been away for
awhile. Been experiencing technical difficulties. Will
be posting more frequently once I can get my damned
computer under control! |
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11-07-2004, 11:30 PM |
#13 |
Member
Kinjo is Online:
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Posts: 455
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I saved and repost some prehack threads that was of
my interest on my drive fro offline reading, and I
reckon many other is doing the same thing. Hopefully
someone (including me, haven't check yet) had saved that
thread and repost it. Anyone remembers what is it titled
under?
__________________
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Magickal Documents for the
Community.
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11-07-2004, 11:46 PM |
#14 |
Member
GeNoCyDe is Offline:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
LadyHydralisk
Hi everyone. This
is sort of a pet project of mine. I have never
actually gotten around to setting it up and trying
it, but I have researched it
extensively.
What I know so far
is:
Replacing the triangle with the
pentacle is required for certain ops.
If
enough sacrifice is provided, the intelligence can
manifest a body out of thin air.
A bonfire
can serve as a kind of physical manifestation,
though it is not mobile. A candle flame can
similarily be affected, though it will not show
shapes to the extent of a bonfire.
If a
body is provided, and the soul can be pushed out,
the intelligence can snatch it for itself. The
soul must have poor "karma", that is, it must have
a great repoire with the will of the universe to
win this battle.
Spirit lights may aid in
concentration and visualization, enough to show a
complete neophyte the phenomena, but it is not
actual physical
manifestation.
Share?
LH | Smoke
works well with some enteties,try some moistened Oak
wood chips over a charcoal briquette in an iron frying
pan. do it with proper ventilation.lol
__________________ No wisdom is wasted. |
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11-08-2004, 02:21 AM |
#15 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 787
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Quote:
Smoke
works well with some enteties,try some moistened
Oak wood chips over a charcoal briquette in an
iron frying pan. do it with proper ventilation.lol
| Great idea.
Hitman to dig up old posts do a search on
google for the appropriate words...then hit "cached"
when you find what you want. It'll bring up a page that
google has had saved on its servers.
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-08-2004, 05:09 AM |
#16 |
Senior Member
Leviathan is Offline:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 635 |
I have not tried this: but I wonder...
Who
has practised Evokation with a Fog Machine? Has it
worked? How
well? _______________________________
"Todays
mighty oak is just yesterdays NUT that held its
ground."- David Icke |
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11-08-2004, 05:21 AM |
#17 |
Senior Member
hitman777 is Offline:
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Posts: 756 |
I once evoked Bael using a lava lamp in the
triangle. Sounds idiotic, but I got very intense
manifestation!
__________________ Sorry, I've been away for
awhile. Been experiencing technical difficulties. Will
be posting more frequently once I can get my damned
computer under control! |
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11-08-2004, 10:16 AM |
#18 |
Member
theblackpeacock is Online:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 244 |
this kinda sounds like self possession, like what
the voudoun people do. |
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11-08-2004, 01:15 PM |
#19 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Wow you evoked Bael? Mind giving us a recap in a
new thread? 
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-08-2004, 09:00 PM |
#20 |
Member
Watcher is Offline:
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I figure you just throw bunchs of energy into the
triangle until it can take a denser shape on that border
area between physical and astral. Thats what the
oldtimers did one way or the other. Done properly it
should be as good as physical, as it's bound to get
anyways. This can be done with thoughtforms too.
You would have to be absolutely dull not to see
it at some point as all humans have some amount of
psychic potential. It can cause real physical damage
too. If I had to test I would practice calling up a
particular entity. Then bring in someone unsuggestable
and uninitiated to see if they see it. Or try and take a
picture, flash would probably work better than digital.
Myself I am deadly scared of a SOLID entity. If you are
physical, and you can walk through a psychic restraint
albeit with discomfort. Then what keeps old Beelzebub
from walking right up to you and swiping off your
head? |
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11-08-2004, 09:09 PM |
#21 |
Senior Member
hitman777 is Offline:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
LadyHydralisk
Wow you evoked
Bael? Mind giving us a recap in a new thread?  | I'm
afraid it wouldn't really be worth a whole thread.  I didn't evoke him in order to learn
"invisibility" or anything, I was pretty much just
double checking on something that Marchosias had told me
and another about him (Bael.) He seemed pretty
intelligent, but gave off kind of a sinister vibe. He
really seemed to have fun with the lava lamp, building
himself inside of it. He was also sort of flickering in
and out superimposed over it at the same time. It was
pretty weird. I'll have to see if I can dig up some of
my old records. If I can, I'll post more on this if
you'd like.
__________________ Sorry, I've been away for
awhile. Been experiencing technical difficulties. Will
be posting more frequently once I can get my damned
computer under control! |
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11-09-2004, 12:49 AM |
#22 |
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Master of the Abyss is Offline:
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11-12-2004, 12:42 AM |
#23 |
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LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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I like that...I would like to get a lava lamp...I
will have to save up my chuck e. cheese tickets. I want
to evoke Bael but I am a bit scared of him, his sigil is
major powerful shit. Like Paimon's, when I held the
solid copy I got dizzy ^_^
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-12-2004, 02:56 AM |
#24 |
Senior Member
hitman777 is Offline:
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THe whole thing that lead up to my evoking Bael was
pretty retarded. I had evoked Marchosias for answers on
a few things, and he told me that Bael was looking to
incarnate. This seemed pretty weird to me, and I pretty
much figured that that wouldn't be a very good thing. So
I evoked Bael to ask him about it. He came off as very
sardonic, and his voice was weird, kind of low and
gravelly, but with almost a shrill quality to it, though
still low (I know I am explaining this horribly.) He
continually kept avoiding my questions, but pretty much
said that he wasn't going to incarnate, after much
prodding, if memory serves me correctly. I don't really
like him very much. He's a dick. So pretty much, the
whole ordeal was all for nothing. Ain't that a kick in
the pants!?
__________________ Sorry, I've been away for
awhile. Been experiencing technical difficulties. Will
be posting more frequently once I can get my damned
computer under control! |
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11-12-2004, 04:44 AM |
#25 |
Senior Member
Grab is Offline:
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I agree with Lady H - the Bael sigil looks really
powerful! I've looked at it many a time, thinking I must
go there... then I read his description, and remember
that he only teaches invisibility. Duh!... not exactly
top of my priorities right now. Is it a blind?
Does he have a lot of hidden abilities? Hitman,
lol, he's a dick? I guess I should evoke him next time I
want demon dick then. 
__________________ Free you mind, or I will do
it for you. |
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11-12-2004, 05:12 AM |
#26 |
Member
Master of the Abyss is Offline:
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Something I forgot regarding physical visibility:
it is a lot easier when you do it in the dark. Sounds
stupid, but I find that when spirits manifest visible to
the physical eye, they will often do so as some sort of
glow or shiny fog. You will probably want to have a
candle on your altar in the circle, but you can step
before the altar and cast a shadow on the triangle which
both produces a dark for shiny things to manifest in and
is a most appropriate symbol.
Demons tend to be
less shiny than other types of entities, though. Perhaps
a gray background will work best for them?
Bael
is indeed quite a nasty. I found it sort of appropriate
he is the first one in the Goetia, because he'll either
scare off people or make them ready for (most of) what
comes after. |
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11-12-2004, 09:50 AM |
#27 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Seems like a few of them want to incarnate, but
they are not able to yet...at least some of them have
not.
Master of the Abyss: Sounds like a really
great idea. In fact maybe I will try it tonight since I
am maybe free for the evening.
Grab I think some
of the demons can make you want to summon them more than
others. For instance, I picked Sitri because I thought
his abilities were funny...and he came across as less
influential than Marbas or Orobas...and I chose both of
those because I was drawn to them unexplainably. I see
Orobas chosen so much. I can't think it's just a
coincidence. Or maybe it's his abilities.
c
u
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-12-2004, 02:06 PM |
#28 |
Senior Member
Grab is Offline:
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Lady H, I think one reason why everyone wants to
play with Orobas first is because Duquette keeps telling
his story everywhere about his first more or less
randomly chosen evocation.
__________________ Free you mind, or I will do
it for you. |
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11-12-2004, 02:18 PM |
#29 |
Member
Bilimbike is Offline:
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Yes, Duquette story is cool, although after hearing
it 200 times, it stops being funny 
__________________ ~658~ |
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11-14-2004, 08:48 AM |
#30 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Yes that is a popular book among occultists, but
I've seen complete newbies go over the list and choose
Orobas for their usually mundane physical needs- having
never read Duquette.
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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11-14-2004, 01:38 PM |
#31 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Quote:
I
figure you just throw bunchs of energy into the
triangle until it can take a denser shape on that
border area between physical and astral. Thats
what the oldtimers did one way or the other. Done
properly it should be as good as physical, as it's
bound to get anyways. This can be done with
thoughtforms too.
You would have to be
absolutely dull not to see it at some point as all
humans have some amount of psychic potential. It
can cause real physical damage too. If I had to
test I would practice calling up a particular
entity. Then bring in someone unsuggestable and
uninitiated to see if they see it. Or try and take
a picture, flash would probably work better than
digital. Myself I am deadly scared of a SOLID
entity. If you are physical, and you can walk
through a psychic restraint albeit with
discomfort. Then what keeps old Beelzebub from
walking right up to you and swiping off your head?
| Oh yay but what
happens when I wake up the next morning exhausted and
drained of energy...with two children jumping on my bed
waiting to be fed? Erm...no thanks. ALso not real big on
the blood sacrifice stuff, dancing takes to much time,
and not only that...have you ever tried throwing alot of
energy at a demon? They will suck it up like there is no
tomorrow. I'm not really mean enough to say "Hey stop
sucking up that energy, do something useless with it and
coalesce as a short furry man in the triangle! Smoke I
like, Lava lamps I like because it's a medium the demon
can manipulate without to much exertion on the part of
the spirit. Well if we got a coven together that
would make it easy to raise energy...I'm afraid I'm
rather limited unless i'm in the mood for alot of
tedious work. And even then if they do take energy they
usually take too much unless you have the foresight to
tell them not to take too much. Or they are polite,
which is spotty amongst Goetia or miscellaneous demons.
The lower ranking ones seem better about it
Eh? Suppose I could deliberately place the energy
myself instead of asking but I might screw myself up
doing it...not real up on energy work.
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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Yesterday, 11:19 PM |
#32 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
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Location: Memphis, TN
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Oh and to answer the question "Why does a demon
not have the ability to manifest in the physical?"
the answer is, they do...they just don't want to
waste the energy and are not required by universal law
to give something for nothing. That is why energy must
be provided for your desire to see this effect.
Generally, as magicians go, no one is really needing
this kind of validation so it's not done, however, a big
bonfire evocation would be very fun with a group.
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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Yesterday, 11:30 PM |
#33 |
Senior Member
Nero is Online:
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Posts: 552 |
Quote:
Originally Posted by
LadyHydralisk
however, a big
bonfire evocation would be very fun with a
group. | Great idea Lady. If we ever again
do a OF meeting, maybe we should add that to our list of
activities. I have never evoked to the physical plane
before but it has occured to my I could try and use
flames instead of smoke as a medium. During a cookout
with some friends I suggested we try it. They being
non-magicial everyone quickly became uncomfortable when
I mentioned "demon" and "summon". Half thought I was
kidding and some that had lived with me before knew I
was not. Noone thought it was a good idea but me. Oh
well, for the best since I was more than a little drunk
at the time.
__________________ Numen Expecto Reputo
Occultam
Except Adonai build the
house, their labor is but lost that build it. Except
Adoni keep the City, the Watchman waketh in
vain.
"The only limits to our
Magick are our own..." - I AM |
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Yesterday, 11:56 PM |
#34 |
Member
BrotherM is Offline:
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Posts: 305
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All of my evocations are to the physical and I can
view the entities, but with my astral senses (so no
mirror). I usually see them as a shape in the triangle
which is made out of light, like a hollogram of sorts. I
can clearly make out colours, backgrounds, eyes, ears,
tails etc. It tends to phase in and out, and usually
takes around 5 minutes until I can view them properly,
but I think this is more due to my eyes adjusting than
anything else. I have never tried to take photos, but I
don't think anything would come out. I might actually
try this now that I have a digital! (ideas ideas - come
here sexy water elementals  ) That said, I have never tried an
actual Physical body of flesh standing there looking at
me - honestly, if that did happen, I would jump out my
window and run for the hills, balls, but I wouldn't be
waiting to find out if Astaroth's dragon is hungry after
so many years in hell! I like the lava lamp idea,
perhaps a big glass jar full of smoke would work well
also? BrotherM
__________________
Blind I
am,
Light I
seek,
Free I
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Today, 01:23 AM |
#35 |
Senior Member
LadyHydralisk is Offline:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 787
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BrotherM we can see the entities and for us it is
no problem, but I have always thought it would be fun to
make those with no astral senses see the entity. I know
it can be done, but honestly I have no people around who
I could safely shock in such a way, so it would be a
fruitless endeavor. It would make for a good defensive
illusion, would it not?
Nero I would love to go
to a big OF meet and do this! But I am not so sure that
most visitors would trust us for sure....
It is a
big reality check when bouncing magical queries off of
non magicals...the shock or dumbfoundedness on their
faces is enough for everyone to realize, once again,
that yes, we truly are the strange.
__________________
This
so-called universe Appears as a juggling, A
picture show. To be happy, look upon it so.
-
Bhairava (Fierce aspect of Siva)
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Today, 01:58 AM |
#36 |
Senior Member
Nero is Online:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: South GA
Posts: 552 |
Quote:
Originally Posted by
LadyHydralisk
Nero I would love
to go to a big OF meet and do this! But I am not
so sure that most visitors would trust us for
sure....
| Strangely I get tagged as a dangerous
magician, reckless and fool hardy. Those who know me,
know I am the safest magician in the world. I never take
chances with my magick. When I do something, I check all
my bases and know I am safe. Sorry, just strikes me as
funny. Not sure why people think otherwise of
me.
__________________ Numen Expecto Reputo
Occultam
Except Adonai build the
house, their labor is but lost that build it. Except
Adoni keep the City, the Watchman waketh in
vain.
"The only limits to our
Magick are our own..." - I AM |
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Today, 02:17 AM |
#37 |
Member
BrotherM is Offline:
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 305
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So, have we ever tried to organise this before?
What is stopping us doing an OF Summoner meeting with a
few sleepers and a camera to see what
happens?
(It has occured to me that physical
distance and visas etc might be a valid reason, but I'm
sure there will be enough of a sub-set of us in a region
to make a workable group.)
BrotherM
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Free I
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