Guao? Options

Does anyone know if the herb Guao (Comocladia glabra), also named carrasco is legal in the U.S, and if there are any distributors? It's a poison ash so I'm not sure of its legality since it doesn't grow in the U.S (Well, P.R is one of the places and it's a U.S territory), but it's a common herb in the santeria practice. Last month I spent about two weeks straight checking out it's legality, and/or distributors and came up with nothing...Since alot of magicians here are master googlers LOL, I'm basically asking for help if anyone knows, again, the legality, and/or distributor in the U.S, or to the U.S.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

Is this usually brewed in teas? To be honest I think that guaco is basically a slang term for a climbing vine.

I'm not saying this is it but I think we are mixing these two up

see links

acerola

and this

guaco


I am not sure totally but I think you will find what you need at that site and they sell the products also.

If I am right I earn Googulus Adeptus Majus 3rd degree standing.

This post has been edited by chaoscrowley37: Feb 21 2006, 07:06 AM

I doubt it's used in teas.. No, I don't think those plants are it, I remember reading that it is a shrub, but those plants you gave the link to are used for skin care, and comocladia glabra when in contact with skin causes dermititis (Sp?), like wolfsbane...Confusing..At first I thought it was the same as comocladia dentada, but if I'm not mistaken the dentada is a tree. When I searched all I came up with was a video that lists the herbs commonly used in santeria, and one was "Guao", and guao is the glabra, aka carrasco, and I don't know if it goes by any other name..I'll try to find the link to one of the 3-4 sites I found with some info on it.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

http://www.crescentbloom.com/plants/Genus/C/O/Comocladia.htm

-That's actually the only link I could find now...And it's a new one, the others just up and dissapeared...I hate yahoo/google.. Other than that I found this small, tiny picture.

(IMG:http://www.kingsnake.com/westindian/tcomocladiaglabra1.JPG)
Another species of poison ash, Comocladia glabra.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

Greetings! I would that this was not what it is but...
You will have a hard time getting this plant unless you travel to Puerto Rico or Haiti. It is considered endangered and also it is extremely toxic. I'm checking my ethnobotanical sources but it may well be that it is too toxic to safely handle and ship without liability. Here are just a few Google listings:

http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=COGL4

http://khpindustries.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120

http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/caribbean/poisonou...ia_glabra.shtml

http://www.similima.com/gp23.html

Here is an exerpt from an interesting live journal article about zombies...it mentions your shrub/tree.

So You Want to Make a Zombi...

Almost everyone has heard of zombies. Most people have even heard that zombies really do exist, even if they bear little resemblance to their shambling, brain-eating fictional portrayal in Night of the Living Dead. The creation of these real zombies is the result of administering a "zombi poison", carefully concocted by practitioners in Haiti. If you were hoping to grow all the ingredients for the zombi poison in your garden, you're out of luck. The best scientific guess is that the active ingredient in the Haitian zombi poison is the toxin of a puffer fish. But there are several plants which are constituents of the zombi poison which contribute to the "overall effect" of the poison. All of this information was taken from Passage of Darkness, by Wade Davis (he's the guy who wrote The Serpent and the Rainbow). He had access to several different versions of the poison, and determined these plants were the principal botanical ingredients:

tcha-tcha
This member of the legume family, Albizia lebbeck, has pharmacological activity due to a group of glycosides known as saponins. While most saponins cannot be absorbed by the intestine, they can be applied topically. The symptoms of poisoning include nausea, vomiting, excessive secretion in the respiratory passages, and pulmonary edema. If fatal, the victim "drowns" in his own fluids. This particular Albizia also contains a particular type of saponin known as sapotoxin, which interferes with cellular respiration in all parts of the body and causes death by weakening all vital functions.

consigne
The tree Trichilia hirta is used medicinally in Cuba, where infusions of the leaves are used to treat anemia, asthma, bronchitis, and pneumonia. It is also used in magic rituals by the Yoruba-Bakongo cults. Relatives of this tree are used by some African tribes to induce vomiting or as an enema; excessive dosages can be fatal.

pois gratter
This liana vine, Mucuna pruriens, does contain psychoactive substances, but that's not why it's used in the zombi poison. The fruit of the plant is covered in trichomes (surface hairs) which cause severe itching due to an enzyme known as mucunain. These trichomes also contain histamine-releasing substances, similar to those found in bee and snake venom. An infusion of this plant is sometimes used to get rid of internal parasites, since the redness, burning, itching, and blistering that the fruit can cause to a person's skin will also be noxious to any intestinal parasites. One hair underneath the skin is enough to produce a reaction.

maman guepes and mashasha
Both of these plants (Urera baccifera and Dalechampia scandens, respectively) are members of the stinging nettle family. When the plant is touched, the stinging hairs break, and fluid that is produced at the base of the hair is injected into the skin. This fluid contains acetylcholine, histamine, and 5-hydroxytryptamine, and causes burning, itching, and swelling.

calmador
This is Jamaican dumbcane, Dieffenbachia sequine. Like other members of the Dieffenbachia, it contains calcium oxalate crystals in its leaves. These crystals irritate tissues causing swelling.

bwa pine
Supposedly this tree, Zanthoxylum martinicense, has a narcotic effect. An infusion of the bark is used in Jamaica to treat syphilis. Chewing on the bark relieves toothaches. The juice of young roots is used to treat intestinal problems. It is used in the zombi poison for its irritating spines.

pomme cajou
This is the cashew plant, Anacardium occidentale, which is a member of the poison ivy family. Raw cashews are known to be poisonous. Like any other member of the poison ivy family, exposure to any part of the cashew plant can cause inflammation of the skin, due to substances which include cardol, anacardic acid, anacardol, and cardanol.

bresillet
The Comocladia glabra tree is detested by the Haitians, but eradication of the tree is difficult since the smoke from burning them is dangerous. The toxic resins given off by the plant cause severe inflammation and dermatitis. The itching caused by the plant is so extreme that most of the damage done to the skin is self-inflicted. A related species in Cuba is considered an evil, diabolical plant: 'Evil comes naturally to it and no one dares touch it.'
Since the zombi poison is normally applied topically, the plants which irritate the skin are important. The itching they cause can make the victim inflict wounds, allowing the poison to enter the bloodstream. Sometimes there are repeated applications of the zombi poison, and wounds inflicted earlier will allow for quicker absorption of these later doses. Once in the bloodstream, the pharmacological ingredients of the poison can do their work.

Pistachios are given to zombies to give them the rest of death.

Gee...are we trying for some Zombie making? Don't mind the body parts falling off on the rug... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/fie.gif)

lol, No, no zombie making...Although....No, kidding! Well, I've even tried searching for seeds, but still found nothing. I have family in P.R, but they know nothing of herbs, and plants, and they wouldn't know where to look, so that's out of the question. Is it safe to say I'm screwed as far as finding this plant is concerned, yet?

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

lol, No, no zombie making...Although....No, kidding! Well, I've even tried searching for seeds, but still found nothing. I have family in P.R, but they know nothing of herbs, and plants, and they wouldn't know where to look, so that's out of the question. Is it safe to say I'm screwed as far as finding this plant is concerned, yet?

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

how about http://www.jaxmed.com/articles/Diseases/p_sumac.htm - sounds like it would work just fine for toxic effects and it looks like the picture - is like poison ivy or poison oak but even worse
(IMG:http://www.jaxmed.com/articles/Diseases/p_sumac.jpg)
E.

This post has been edited by esoterica: Feb 24 2006, 09:51 AM

Does anyone know if the herb Guao (Comocladia glabra), also named carrasco is legal in the U.S, and if there are any distributors? It's a poison ash so I'm not sure of its legality since it doesn't grow in the U.S (Well, P.R is one of the places and it's a U.S territory), but it's a common herb in the santeria practice.

If the customs could figure out what was in the parcel, they wouldn't let it into the country. Due to it being classified as a toxic substance there are four different Acts under which it could be seized and destroyed. So I would agree with the suggestion to look for a substitute.

Ah, I already did. Wolfsbane ;-).

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

I don't know what these four acts supposedly are, but there is no law against brining in a plant that contains poisonous alkaloids. The only act that controls the possession of plants is the Controlled Substances Act- and that is not on it.

I have not bothered to look into what alkaloids it contains, but I know my plants pretty well and that isn't in any of the families that contains illicit substances, and even if it were, because it is not specifically listed it will not be seized in all likelihood.

Possessing poisons is not illegal, so I find it strange that anyone would claim that there are laws that would ban its import. Actually, even more so, congress passed an act in the early to mid 90s requiring the FDA to prove that an herb or substance was inherently dangerous before it could ban it. It's also why our 'supplement' market is crowded with crappy products of unknown safety.

However, because you know it is a poison, if you were to feed it to someone who wasn't entirely aware of the risks, and they were injured or died, you would be criminally liable. Even if they were aware of the risks, once they're dead it's hard to prove it, huh? heh.

There are millions of plants being brought into this country daily that are poisonous. I mean, the potatoe plant is poisonous. It's a nightshade, meaning it contains atropine, hyoscomine and scopolamine. Tons of other non-indigenous herbs in the same family are also brought in. Salvia Divinorin, the diviner's sage, being stupidly promoted as a legal pot-substitute or legal LSD is also being imported without any of those being seized. I think it would be safe to say the Gov't would classify it as a poison.

Hamilton

Well, it belongs to the poison ivy family, so by poison I meant it's a nasty skin irritant. I still haven't found any place that imports comocladia glabra, anyway. I found a nice substitute, so, all's well.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux