Pissing Forus Off Options

This is from a friend of mine (J-Dog) who currently is not a member...

If you have any questions regarding this post ask and I will direct them to him and post the response...

Daev


J-Dog:

Around august time, I kind of pissed of Foras, ( I know the original posting of this is archived somewhere) but anyway, I pissed him off and he tested my circle but got through.
and the feeling jolted me like I got shocked or something. It was really creepy because he got to me and I know he did.
Well, after that, I summoned him and put the pressure on him to do something for me (and he did) but since I was scared and pissed at him for what he did and not to mention, being unsatisfied with how he went about giving me what I wanted, I punished him and since he was uncooperative, I banished him.
Now I know y'all are going to ask why did i piss him off and i will tell you that a few months prior to that, i had a disturbing experience with andromalius and well...i had seeked the help of a well-known magician on how to handle a goetian and he replied back to me around the time i had evoked foras.
unfortunately, i will admit through fault of my own that foras wasn't andromalius. he was friendlier to me but since he was a demon, i couldn't take no shorts and well my attitude offended him and hurt his demonic pride and that's when he infiltrated my circle (which isn't also good) because what if he knew i had a weak circle but decided to show me that after the fact.
but my circles (in time w/ more practice) became stronger because if you can keep bune out, then you're good cuz bune is huge and he's no joke.
anyways, moving on, i will say that personally, i have come to learn that demons are into everything and they are everywhere, and throughout most of my life i've worked with them one way or another but only through these rituals, it has been more directed and concentrated.

J-Dog:

i had forgotten to add this little tid bit in, the demons make corny threats but i wouldn't antagonize them to prove anything.
i feel that you must have a strong will to turn them down.
they're there, and they always have been and they will give you what you want but only use them when it's absolutely necessary.
you have to have a strong will about these things because they are pro's and they are very persistant.
what i didn't mentioned was, i got something for their ass when they come back.

Daev: How were they threatening you?

J-Dog:

well for me when i talk to a spirit of any kind, they are talking in many directions at once and sometimes they babble things.
this could my own brain due to the use of many drugs in the past or this is how they talk because they are on another level.
when i talk to demons they throw in bits and pieces of things that are suppose to scare me i guess, but it doesn't.
it's kind of like a girl who wants to be with you or spend more time with you so she offers to take you out and get you things or whatever, but if you're not interested in her, then you're not interested in her.
so when she picks up that you're not falling for her charm, then she throws an attitude and gets verbally nasty with you.
seeing that she is insecure and immature, you blow her off but with caution because you don't want to provoke her.
another thing i have figured out is i haven't been doing my lbrp or mp exercises lately and maybe this is why things been going this way.

Daev: Ohh, Were they death threats or were they like telling you that they wern't gonna co-operate with you?

J-Dog:

No, they were'nt givig me any death threats. But enough about me.

While posts like this are amusing in regards to sensationalism and neophyte fodder...I must say they ultimately do a great disservice to those who wish to earnestly pursue Goetic Evocation.

The Goal of an Evocation is to produce a desired outcome/accomplish ones will....not to engage in hostilities towards the spirit or any of its servitors. In regards to obtaining ones desire through the summoning of a demon, or any other spirit for that matter, does not mean one has to be a Satanist or worship demons/gods nor do you have to threaten or constrain the spirit. A person may still be successful even if he/she chooses to believe that demons are not real, taking the belief that they (demons) are merely projections of the magicians will. I myself used to adopt this mode of thought....However I have seen too much evidence to the contrary so I choose to give these entities/demons/spirits their due reward as well as respect. Now respect does not mean worship, it's more or less a matter of understanding the dynamics involved. When a magician understands how to use this "Demonic-Buzz-Saw".....He/she prefers to use it to cut wood, rather than sticking their foot into it! In other words make it work for you instead of against you.

Most problems in Evocations occur when a person tries to threaten, constrain, or torture a spirit via the means laid down in the various Grimories. Problems also occur when there is nothing offered in exchange for the spirits services....The main point to remember is that nobody rides for free and nothing is owed. If you wish to read a bit more on this you can access my website @ http://www.iblackmagick.com/

Invoke often!

marcus

demonicvanguard, i don't like your tone concerning my posts.
i feel that you have completely missed what i had allow to share.

you see, that's the enticing thing that i find about doing magick myself, no matter what one shares with you, be it on the computer, book, or seminar, you will have to learn yourself.

and what's beautiful about this is everybody's experiences will be different in the broadest sense.

another thing fellow adept, no, i do not encourage evocation to t just anybody because either way, it's a serious thing that has serious consequences.

so i kindly urge you when you get to time, to re-read what daev posted.

This post has been edited by sharzobel: Jun 17 2005, 10:55 PM

demonicvanguard, I've found the opposite to be true. When I evoke a Goetic spirit, I treat them like what they are: slaves. They are meant to be treated as slaves. I have rewarded them in the past, and didn't always take the approach with them that I do now, and I have found that I get the best results when I treat them like, well, slaves.

Surely you can see that there are different schools of thought on how to engage with a spirit or entity, and it is not uncommon at all for people to take the aggressive approach with these 'evil' entities if anything its encouraged by the classic books on the subject. They arn't your friends and will suposadly screw you over if they can. In most of the older publications on Goetic magic there is an emphasis on the idea that you are using higher powers of good to force your will over the evil. Another thing they emphasise is an almost state of arrogance that the magician should possess when conversing with them to demostrate your connection to these said powers.

Another thing i've seen discussed is that a friendly, highly respectful almost equal approach to the entities is viewed as a perversion and degression of the use of the higher power.

Basically I dont see why demonicvanguard needed to be so negative about it.

I haven't actually tried to summon anything yet but hopefully i will soon and the approach i had was to treat the entity more like an equal i mean isn't it better to be treated with respect rather than assualted. If you in the same position were "asked" to do something would you be more apt to do it than if someone tried to force you to. you catch more flies with honey than with viniger right.