Use Of Drugs For Magickal Purposes, questions Options

What are your opinions on it? Does the drug induced state help/hinder your grasp on magick, or both? I've thought about if it would alter your ability to grasp energy, yet at the same time, could it help you become more aware of the surroundings, or your self-conscious? So what are the opinions, or facts on this subject?

Though there are millions of people who will attest to mystical experiences interwoven with drug use, I have never personally heard of anyone show a practical use for drugs in magic.

The LBRP isn't a more effective banishing when stoned. Your "spell to ruin an enemy" will not be stronger because you smoked crack. There are all manner of interesting visions and beautiful insights to be gained from drugs, but they just don't help if you're interesting in doing something practical.

I have very often seen people pass off a useless drug habit with occultism as an excuse. I think this is just playing around, and can't think of many other activities where drugs make your work more effective. If these people put half the effort they put toward "mastery of drug consciousness" toward mastery of ordinary consciousness, we would likely see a lot more magicians in the world.

Though there are millions of people who will attest to mystical experiences interwoven with drug use, I have never personally heard of anyone show a practical use for drugs in magic.

The LBRP isn't a more effective banishing when stoned. Your "spell to ruin an enemy" will not be stronger because you smoked crack. There are all manner of interesting visions and beautiful insights to be gained from drugs, but they just don't help if you're interesting in doing something practical.

I have very often seen people pass off a useless drug habit with occultism as an excuse. I think this is just playing around, and can't think of many other activities where drugs make your work more effective. If these people put half the effort they put toward "mastery of drug consciousness" toward mastery of ordinary consciousness, we would likely see a lot more magicians in the world.

I like the way you think, but let me remind you that it all depends on the use of the substance, for example i use yage or ayahuaska to do what i cal dream walking, which is like meditating and also to purge myself, because yage its a powerful soul and body purger, and second let me remind you that the true ancestors of the magicians are the shamans, and shamans do experiment with natural substances, because they know the power of plants its incredible when it comes to showing you a spiritual path, but let us not confuse spirituality with a moment of fun color, plants' (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wizard.gif) spirits must be handled with responsability, care, love and intelligence

Probably the worst drugs available these days are the legal ones advertised in magazines, TV, and other mass-media productions. These mood-altering drugs have reduced physicians to the level of drug-pushers in many cases, and I estimate the negative influence of this 100-billion-dollar business at far greater than those of pot or any "street" drug. I have personally witnessed far more trouble caused in people's lives from legal prescription drugs used as directed than from any other substance barring alcohol.

My particular peeve is hearing people talk about relaxant drugs taken for "anxiety." Stress is a natural and healthy reaction to danger! If you are sitting around one day and all of a sudden freak out for no apparent reason, that is an anxiety disorder; but if you are upset about expenses and social problems, your anxiety is a starting point for dealing with your troubles.

I have read a significant amount of drug literature and consider myself very familiar with the effects of a wide variety of psychotropic drugs, some from personal experience. As for spirituality and drugs, I don't buy it. Life experience in the ordinary world makes us grow as people, and the diversity of modern life allows us to have a huge variety of experiences that Peruvian shamans simply cannot enjoy. We are able to participate in all sorts of interpersonal situations, achieve individual goals, and go all over the world if we wish. To someone living their entire life in the confines of a tribe localized to 100 square miles of remote wilderness, the drug experience may be the only way to know something totally different. I have never known anyone who could truly attribute their maturity, spiritual outlook, or any other advanced insight or knowledge to something tied specifically to a drug experience. On the other hand, even a meager amount of life experience brings real and dramatic changes.

As said before, I have also never encountered someone who could realistically attribute magical success or failure to drugs. "If only I had been stoned!" is about the worst possible excuse for a failed magical action.

I suppose it really depends on what you want from magic. Strange visions? Cliche spiritual insights? A sense of personal growth measured only in terms of attitude and outlook? OK then maybe drugs will do it for you, but what is it worth to you? There are a thousand ways to attack the idea of using drugs for magic, and I'm sur emost people here can point out specific instances where drug use went horribly wrong for magicians and others too. Where are the specific instances when drugs were really useful to you (any of you) as part of magic, and more importantly what did that magic do for you?

Probably the worst drugs available these days are the legal ones advertised in magazines, TV, and other mass-media productions. These mood-altering drugs have reduced physicians to the level of drug-pushers in many cases, and I estimate the negative influence of this 100-billion-dollar business at far greater than those of pot or any "street" drug. I have personally witnessed far more trouble caused in people's lives from legal prescription drugs used as directed than from any other substance barring alcohol.

My particular peeve is hearing people talk about relaxant drugs taken for "anxiety." Stress is a natural and healthy reaction to danger! If you are sitting around one day and all of a sudden freak out for no apparent reason, that is an anxiety disorder; but if you are upset about expenses and social problems, your anxiety is a starting point for dealing with your troubles.

I have read a significant amount of drug literature and consider myself very familiar with the effects of a wide variety of psychotropic drugs, some from personal experience. As for spirituality and drugs, I don't buy it. Life experience in the ordinary world makes us grow as people, and the diversity of modern life allows us to have a huge variety of experiences that Peruvian shamans simply cannot enjoy. We are able to participate in all sorts of interpersonal situations, achieve individual goals, and go all over the world if we wish. To someone living their entire life in the confines of a tribe localized to 100 square miles of remote wilderness, the drug experience may be the only way to know something totally different. I have never known anyone who could truly attribute their maturity, spiritual outlook, or any other advanced insight or knowledge to something tied specifically to a drug experience. On the other hand, even a meager amount of life experience brings real and dramatic changes.

As said before, I have also never encountered someone who could realistically attribute magical success or failure to drugs. "If only I had been stoned!" is about the worst possible excuse for a failed magical action.

I suppose it really depends on what you want from magic. Strange visions? Cliche spiritual insights? A sense of personal growth measured only in terms of attitude and outlook? OK then maybe drugs will do it for you, but what is it worth to you? There are a thousand ways to attack the idea of using drugs for magic, and I'm sur emost people here can point out specific instances where drug use went horribly wrong for magicians and others too. Where are the specific instances when drugs were really useful to you (any of you) as part of magic, and more importantly what did that magic do for you?

well yage has not been considered a drug the way any of those chemical poisons and even maruhuana is, yage its trully a soul purger, plus the only person who could prepare the brevage from this sacred plant must be a certified kofan, inga, sibundoy or any other taita or shaman, certified by the south american governments, plus it can not me drunk any day, must be a day lined with cosmic change or a very important tribal date, what it does to you its show you the reason for any illment or anithing thats affecting your spiritual or mental state trought visions..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wizard.gif)