Where Does Magic Come From? Options

I have done quite a bit of energy work, and im starting to get confused.

Where does the energy come from?

Psionics says directly from the mind.

Chakras says from below, from nature,

Middle pillar has energy directly from the divine involved.

I've heard of energy coming directly from yourself.

so i'm asking.


WHERE DOES IT REALLY COME FROM?

ALL THESE PLACES? JUST ONE?

WHATS THE DIFFERENCE?

IS THERE ONE?

Magic is an overarching generalization of a group of phenomenon not specifically classified scientifically in any empirical manner. Once defined, classified, experimentally verified, etc., it is no longer (classically defined as) magic. So asking 'where does magic come from' is pretty broad. Magic is change, the act of Magic is change in accordance with will (all change is in accordance with a will, though not necessarily just your own - such as divine will, etc.). Therefore the question 'where does magic come from' is erroneous - magic comes from existence, it is existence.

Quite true. Imagine trying to explain the electromagnetic spectrum and the theories of radiation before the experiments of Marie Curie. Tough show.

"What? An invisible force capable of change? Where is your proof?" We now are able to check it in hertz, as well as with a geiger counter. By looking into the patterns in nature that are measurable, we can find tendencies using the physical properties that we can readily measure: Time, Space, and Excitablility (ability to energize, via heat or some other means to measure amount of change), and other forces that are in a constant state of flux.

If you had a rock of uranium in ancient celtic Ireland, they would have simply thought of it as "the stone of disease" from it's radioactive properties. Now, we know it to be "the rod that runs our powerplants!"

Having specified that you want to know where the energy comes from, this is a different question that asking where magic comes from.

The world, the mind, the divine, the body - energy can be drawn from any of these places. We all have a different way to understand energy work and as Azereth said, energy follows thought. This also means that wherever you are intending to draw the energy from is where it comes from - although, to varying degrees of efficiency depending on your degree of openness and connection to this source. This is part of the reason there are so many different paradigms. That doesn't mean that there's no way to know where you are personally drawing energy from, however.

Very true. This may explain why there are so many religions out there. The means of drawing power from higher dimensional sources becomes streamlined when the visualization is given a cultural spin, flavor, and/or bias. Unfortunately, this is a double-edged sword which becomes tainted with the poison of vehement tribalism inherent to the Human Animal.

Myself, for instance, I work energy from a paradigm that recognizes a universal substrate that literally permeates and composes everything, tying the various levels of existence together.

Why don't you just come out already and call yourself a Jedi!? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Just picking that paradigm is not enough, although it can be a start. After coming to some understanding of how you connect to and fit into existence, you have to begin looking at it genuinely through that lens. There is an existentialist obstacle there for most people - how do you know you're looking through the right lens?

Especially true for those in the beginning stages of metaphysical practice. Some never make it past this obstacle, and are forced into novice-hood for years because of this viewpoint .

The fact of the matter is that you don't and can't know, at least not so early on. Your paradigm will grow and develop on its own over time, and you should remain open minded throughout in order to allow that philosophical evolution to occur.

I get a visualization of different drops of water (will, wisdom, and understanding) on a sheet of linen (cloth of existence). They will spread over the cloth (meditation and understanding), from different places (different paradigms), but overtime they eventually expand and even overlap and integrate each other until (after constant application) the entire linen becomes soaked (the will and the truth become integrated- enlightenment (?)).

Over time, you develop a firmer understanding and experiential basis for your paradigm, and your work will become more effective. You do have to start somewhere though, and preferably somewhere that is supported by your current degree of understanding.

Some systems work better than others, what can I say. I tried various ones, and am still experimenting with other methods.

Some people prefer to draw from an elemental paradigm, seeing 4 or 5 elements, either hermetic or eastern. Others prefer to imagine energy as coming from various deities who represent the various modes of energy. A kabbalist might draw energy from the 32 paths. Runes offer 24 modes of energy. Tarot can offer a variety of modes as well. There are 7 planets.

Or the Force. Or other people. Or the inner sanctum of your own mind. Or...anywhere. Hey, it's everywhere!

All these things are different in my opinion because there is only one Essential Force, one Primary Causitive Principle,

Which, by the way, could be acronymized PCP for your experiential pleasure! (comic relief. Sorry. That was a weak attempt).

which is structured into various modes of energy according to material patterns, psychological patterns, and spiritual principles developed ultimately from material and psychological patterns in action. Which came first is like the chicken and the egg question.

Trying to find out what came first, the driving force or the mechanism that processes it... It completely boggled me. I damn near-- no wait, I DID experience magickal burnout from trying to figure that out.

We can use those symbols and the energetic modes they ultimately represent to draw energy that is already structured, into actions directed by our intention.

But that begs a question, what of intentions that are not readily materialized or symbolized? Earlier I thought of trying to come up with a language made specifically for magick, so I can cite your response there as a good answer, but then again, how would one go about acquiring the divinely inspired symbols for said memes?

Everyone who does energy work, draws that energy from somewhere, and can define where it comes from. It may not always be the same from one person to the other, but ultimately all that matters is that the intention is moving energy. At first, however, it needs anchors at both ends - a place to get energy from, and a place to move it to. Generally most practitioners that I know have become more abstracted over time. I think that it's possible that in most cases the beginner needs to have something more solidly defined because this is how we understand things best at first.

This is the part where I say, "WHY DIDN'T YOU TELL ME EARLIER, VAGRANT!?" Which is when you would reply, "You never asked." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/13.gif)

Wonderful post. Bravo.

But that begs a question, what of intentions that are not readily materialized or symbolized? Earlier I thought of trying to come up with a language made specifically for magick, so I can cite your response there as a good answer, but then again, how would one go about acquiring the divinely inspired symbols for said memes?

(Note: A meme is a thought-unit, a conceptual structure. I.e. the idea of a boat is a meme, composed of other memes which are the various concepts that ultimately came together to form idea of a boat. The memes of bouyancy, the physical laws as structured information processable by the mind, all of the materials and tools that were inclusive of the possibilities inherent in the creation of a boat and means to do so, etc. Those memes likewise are components composed of other components, etc. - in short memes are the atoms and molecules of thought and consciousness, although it is fair to say consciousness is a medium of thought, composed of memes in the same way that air can be a medium for the molecules that are percieved as 'smells'. It is complex, but useful in mapping concepts as structures.) edit: Let me clarify that point, consciousness is the substrate of which memes are formed, and is the medium through which they move - pure consciousness itself is 'the super-meme', similar in its relationship to memes as the time-space continuum is related to the matter and activity that takes place within it.

Almost unimaginably rare is the truly isolated meme, they combine and recombine in a process of universal psychic alchemy that dates back to the inception of consciousness. Memes are the substrate of that universal Force given the most primal structure, regardless of how complex that structure is - it is the first entry into manifestation. All of these memes no matter how new a configuration it is, is composed of the original primal memes, the first forays of the Ruach Elohim, the Force, the Elements, etc., into the manifested world. One could suppose that the devopment of consciousness is in itself a collection of solidified memes capable of directing the evolution of less developed memes. additional edit: consciousness here is reference to intellectual consciousness, self-awareness as related to 'thought' and 'thinking'; the structure which governs for us how we think and what we think, passed down to us through conditioning that has developed over time due to the impact of memes. In a way it is the governing meme current of human cultural consciousness, different for different cultures which are subcurrents to the greater human current.

The suggestion here is that consciousness itself is just a collection of memes attached to an organic processor. To say 'just' makes it sound like less than it is. If you sit and think about it for a while, it's a mind-bogglingly remarkable process.

In any case, all symbols which somehow connect us to that greater ocean of undifferentiated or as yet unmanifested memes be they in a universal field of consciousness or otherwise, are completely arbitrary. Established symbols simply connect to pre-established meme-currents (currents through which various memes with a commonality among them flow into and out of manifestation). Establishing a new meme current requires nothing more than the regular usage - the more people to use the better - of a new symbol intended (intention directs energy, memes are structured energy) as a connection to this current. You don't even have to describe it in words as we know them. It is true that materializing new memes (new configurations, really) is very difficult.

As far as divinely inspired symbols go though, there is no inspiration more divine than your own. You might open your mind, allow the current to enter your consciousness, and then wait for your subconscious to show you an appropriate symbol it will be willing and able to make that connection through, but that's about as close as it gets. The symbol itself, in a universal sense, is arbitrary - it's just an agreed upon symbol that represents a kind of pact between you and your mind, or the universal mind, to establish this new current and put it into play.

Remember though, memes have to be shared and passed around to make an impact on the 'meme-pool'. The more influence it develops, the stronger the current itself will become.

This ties back to the topic directly at hand; established sources of energy are going to be more influential. That is why 'acient' symbols are so prevolent, popular, and powerful. They weight of the memes behind them represent vast currents which can be drawn upon. The memes themselves are a bit like gateways to those unstructured currents, as many of them are structures of intention meant to convey the 'concept' of unstructured energies moving throughout creation as a causitive force.



peace

This post has been edited by Vagrant Dreamer: Jun 22 2009, 08:21 PM