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Greetings!

I would like some help in a choice that I have to make so if anyone could help me I would appreciate it. I want to study the art of evocation of spirits to the physical plane, but I don't wanna do it by myself, I wanna join a group may a mentor, I always loved the free-masons, but after recently speaking to a member he disencouraged me saying that they don't work with that type of magick, so I've got my eyes set on the GD now. I would like to know, in which direction would you guys point me, or even to another order, that will help me with my primary goal that is to learn evocation, and secondary that is to learn all I can about the astral plane.

Thank you for the help.

Ps. I know that it will take alot of practice and time to be able to summon a spirit to the physical plane.

How old are you? I too had hopes of looking into the mason community, but you have to be 21, and I'm 3 years off (IMG:style_emoticons/default/13.gif). Are any lodges of any of these orginazations around your area? Best bet would be to work with what's near you. I know of no other lodge from any organization, and no teacher so I'm personaly doomed to self teaching myself. lol. The GD confuses the hell out of me, and might be a bit overwhelming to you, and the O.T.O is alright I guess, if you have money to give unless you don't want to advance. If you're in cali go look for thaibon, and the OTA, lol..Goodluck with everything.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

I am not really sure what to think of your post. You ask for suggestions for orders yet your only desired out come is for evocation. Every order I can think of GD, AA, AS, OTO, SOL, AMORC, BOTA, etc etc teach to allow the student to achieve the goal of the great work. They do NOT just teach you enough to evoke and let you run off. They are not built like that. Also they are all big on teaching a good foundation first before they get into the things you might find interesting. I cannot speak for the others but the minimum time for the GD to reach the inner order is around 4 years. Although I do not know anyone, myself included who can or has done it in the minimum time. It always takes longer to do it justice. That is of course if you are even admitted to the inner order. Just because you finish the outer order doesn't automatically give you a invite.

Also as a side note the Masions do not practice magick.

Ok my rant aside, if evocation is all you are interested in then you do not need an order to do it. Pick up a copy of Summoning Spririts. It has an outline of a couple of months to get ready and tells you everything in simple language. Or one I prefer pick of Secrets of the Magickal Grimoires by Aaron Leitch. He explores all the old texts and gives straight talk on how to perform the operations as the grimoires tell you to.

Bottom line if all you are interested in is evocation it is not hard. Getting a spirit to answear you is pretty easy actually. Dealing with the after effects is the hard part.

Hi nero,

I have that book by Konstatinos, I haven't finished reading it yet cause I just got it. So you think that I can study evocation by myself and it will work?
About the orders, I want a strong magickal foundation, that's why I wanna join a group, cause I think that a good foundation is essetial for any long time success. But I'm the kind of person who has to see results, in order to spend 2, 20 years any amount of time studying something, I'm not very strong on faith alone I need to see results.

thank you for the reply

I'm 24 so I don't have the age contraint, but nero said that the free-masons don't perform magick, that was one of the reasons I wanted to join>

THank you for your reply!

How old are you? I too had hopes of looking into the mason community, but you have to be 21, and I'm 3 years off (IMG:style_emoticons/default/13.gif). Are any lodges of any of these orginazations around your area? Best bet would be to work with what's near you. I know of no other lodge from any organization, and no teacher so I'm personaly doomed to self teaching myself. lol. The GD confuses the hell out of me, and might be a bit overwhelming to you, and the O.T.O is alright I guess, if you have money to give unless you don't want to advance. If you're in cali go look for thaibon, and the OTA, lol..Goodluck with everything.

.::Sempre Bene::..::Chris::.
-Fiat Lux

Well, faith and will go hand and hand (Atleast in my opinion, don't jump down my throat lol), and you need will to perform evocations..Since when evoking you're in a sort of hypnotic state sensitive to 'receiving' the spirit, it's unlikely that if you were watching an evocation you'd see anything...So there's no getting out of putting in the work to get the results...Magic isn't like the mafia, no quick fixes. lol...With good willpower, knowledge, and a tad of artistic splash, there's no reason why you shouldn't be fine in your evocation studies/practices.

Another thing I would like to ask, is anybody here able to evoke a spirit to the physical plane, or know of anybody that does, cause I've heared all around that it is possible and in the book "summoning spirits" the author also says it is possible, but I've never actually spoke to anybody that is actually able to do that.


thanks


Ps. I would just like to know if it is sometthing that actally happens.

This post has been edited by Zorthgo: Mar 10 2006, 12:39 PM

Yes it is possibe. I have seen physical manifestation before. It is rare but it does happen. Although I want to point out that it is not important to have physical manifestation in order to get results.

well I actually wanna talk to an astral being, and I would perfer if it wasn't just a voice in my head, because than I might think I'm going crazy and should be commited. The only reason I wanna evoke spirits is so I can learn from them, I don't really need the spirit to do anything for me, I rather do it my self, But these being have been around for a while now and I would really love to be able to learn from them. So that's the reason that I want so much to be able to evoke diferent beings, just to learn more about life and the universe and anything the would like to share with me. Do you think I'm a little crazy for wanting this?

Yes it is possibe. I have seen physical manifestation before. It is rare but it does happen. Although I want to point out that it is not important to have physical manifestation in order to get results.

Grab a copy of Aleister Crowley's "Magick in Theory and Practice" and study that along with Konstant's book. Getting physical manifestations, especially hearing a manifestation of noise in the physical, is difficult and takes a long time to achieve. For quite some time, your work will seem like its "in your head". Overall, I like K's book, but a big mistake that he makes is not fully explaining what he means by a physical manifestation. Other than poltergeist activity, spirits do not necessarily manifest physically....rather after time it will seem like that because the magickian has mastered being in both the physical and astral world at the same time. This is apparent from the method that Konstantinos uses. He wants the magickian to enter the astral and go and "get" the spirit. Seems a bit far fetched? Its because it is lol. Konstantinos is actually having the magickian simultaneously enter the astral and physical world (perhaps "enter" is not the right word as we always exist in both, more like being aware in both at the same time)....hence the appearance of what many consider a "physical manifestation".

So still nobody but me would be able to see the entity even if it were evoked to the physical plane?

That depends on how intuitive they are....though for them to see it just as you do, they would have to have developed their astral senses. If not, they might be able to catch a quick glimps of light or perhaps just feel like something is there. Overall though, unless your working with other magickians, you are the only one who would be able to see it.