Superstition Nonsense, need some help Options

As long as I have been conscience of my of being, I have always heard that the Necronomicon was, well evil, satanistic material. ANd I am sure that the people who stated that are just ignorant, superstitious fanatics. Recently I have been really doing ceremonial, but the necronomicon looks interesting. I know I am just ignorant in this field but why do people say that this book is just no good? IN these forums, I have read that many people find this book useful, but if I use it am I going to end up going nuts or anything like that.

Thanks,

Mike M.

ps. Dont be offended, anyone who reads this, for any reason.

As long as I have been conscience of my of being, I have always heard that the Necronomicon was, well evil, satanistic material. ANd I am sure that the people who stated that are just ignorant, superstitious fanatics. Recently I have been really doing ceremonial, but the necronomicon looks interesting. I know I am just ignorant in this field but why do people say that this book is just no good? IN these forums, I have read that many people find this book useful, but if I use it am I going to end up going nuts or anything like that.

Thanks,

Mike M.

ps. Dont be offended, anyone who reads this, for any reason.

Like any system, you will find that it has its risks. The important thing is that you explore the system before jumping into any sort of iniating type rituals. For example, if you wanted to explore enochian you would not jump right in to scyring the aethyrs. You would study the system, work with some of the spirits, etc. Just apply the same to the Necronomicon. As far as going insane, just stay away from the Urilla text and I think that you will be alright (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

As long as I have been conscience of my of being, I have always heard that the Necronomicon was, well evil, satanistic material. ANd I am sure that the people who stated that are just ignorant, superstitious fanatics. Recently I have been really doing ceremonial, but the necronomicon looks interesting. I know I am just ignorant in this field but why do people say that this book is just no good? IN these forums, I have read that many people find this book useful, but if I use it am I going to end up going nuts or anything like that.

Thanks,

Mike M.

ps. Dont be offended, anyone who reads this, for any reason.

Greetings Brother,

The Necronomicon is certainly not for the faint of heart. Lots of losers have nothing better to do than to point a finger at the Nec and call it a fraud while they try to whack off about how smart they are. Dan Harms is Simons #1 hater. If you read the Necronomicon book review section U will understand just how nuts Dan Harms is. You will also see how Simon rebutts him. Losers like to point thier fingers at winners because it makes them feel better about them selves.

The Necronomicon is not for tree huggers. It is for people with big cajones. The forces there are very powerful. Those who are bold and persue it gain much.

Peace.

if you wanted to explore enochian you would not jump right in to scyring the aethyrs.

When I attend Lon Milo Duquette's workshop last year, lots of us knew nothing of Enochian and we scryed some aethyrs. You can do the first ten or so quite easily. Just thought I would mention that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When I attend Lon Milo Duquette's workshop last year, lots of us knew nothing of Enochian and we scryed some aethyrs. You can do the first ten or so quite easily. Just thought I would mention that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I stand corrected! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/oops.gif)

It is my understanding that the Necronomicon is to be treated with respect for a few reasons

. First, the ritual included is abbreviated. As was customary, steps preparatory to ritual, such as banishings, are abbrieviated or omitted entirely on the assumption that mages would know those particulars.

Second, there are barbarous words of power included in the rituals which resonate to powerful energies. Unlike most magical operations where fluffy bunnies are selfom capable of rending the time-space continuum, word of power magic can achieve results all out of proportion to the skill of the caster. This warning becomes more significant when considered in conjunction with the already stated warning about the ritual structures being incomplete. Things can get out of hand for the inexperienced.

Third, considering the nature of the magick contained in this volume, these are extreme workings which usually hold appeal to beings incarnating from a lower realm. No value judgement there, most of my friends are demons incarnate. It's just worth noting that contact with powerful entities from the Qlipoth can be imbalancing to humans and those using a human perspective.

motsie

This post has been edited by motsie: Sep 11 2006, 03:08 AM

Not doing the proper banishings can be a problem as well! In the beginnings of my experimentation w/ the Necro. I did not do any banishings at the onset. In time that proved to cause all sort of psychic problems and emotional turmoil. In time I learned the LBRP from repeated summonings of MARUTUKKU. From then on I never did any rites w/o the LBRP preceding the Callings. In the start, it would be wise to call upon ARANUNNA for he is the techer to initiates and can lead you to the ways of Master ENKI (and ultimately Evolution!)

Greetings 'Suxur-Mash596,

Aranunna I salute you! I think there is an astronomical difference from working the Necronomicon as a Ceremonial Magician and working the Necronomicon as a priest of the Necronomicon.

For example I never do any banishings. I regard Bandar and the 50 names as angels of my religion. So I have no fear of them. As a priest of Enki these forces are extremely friendly with me. Even the death dealing 4 horsemen the urim brothers come as friends.

Of course when I encounter the foul demons I use the exorcisms listed in the Maklu text to banish them. However I never invoke the foul forces of the Urilla text,

If Necronomicon is worked with a pure heart and good intentions very seriously banishings should not be at all neccessary.

If you are using the book with an evil heart and ill intent then may Nergal see to it that you get what you get.

Peace!

To add, its been quite some months that i did not do any evocations.. So i was a bit worried about wotking with a new name from the 50.. So i did the double circle astrally with watcher told to guard etc.. But i was amazed that when i called the Name, i almost like felt meeting an old close friend from what i could feel.
Working as a priest is indeed kool..

Smashernyc666, I do banishings not to rid myself of what I am calling, it is to rid my temple of the other useless "things". It is also to seperate myself form the outside--concentration of microcosm from the macrocosm. I want to clean the temple so to say of unwanted influences. I want my calling to be clean of un-clean/harmful/useless spirits. Your method seems dangerous to my eyes--but DO WHAT THOU WILT...........

Greetings 'Suxur-Mash596,

When Bandar has been properly fed he eats any demon in the general proximity. I have heard the theory that when touching Bandars sword to banish him with the left hand it helps ground you. However I never banish Bandar. Let it be noted that unless you are sacrificing at least once every three days he should be banished to preserve his life force.

I do exorcisms whenever I feel thay are needed but never at the conclusion of ritual.

Peace

Smasher--I ran into an assortment of problems when I did not banish pre calling. Your theory of the spirits using your own thoughts and will to gauge their response is accurate as well. For that reason a banishing is needed--for me at least! I would suggest to any beginners to do so as well. Once experience has been deemed attained---then do w/o the banishings if one wills to.

I say to banish pre-calling for the safety of the would be mages sanity really! I do not want to see any brothers in a mental ward or anything to that degree--ya know? Remember at the beginnings of your magickal days Smasher---do you not remember the abrupt change in thought patterns and processes--add in about every passing spirit and the possiblity of madness lies oh so close.

Anyways--MARUTUKKU taught me the technique--so I say it is quite alright then!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blablabla.gif)

Regarding those who bash the Necronomicon, I believe that most do so because of a philosophical disagreement with its belief system rather than any genuine concern about "forgery." The Necronomicon approach is more blunt and direct than that of many other magickal systems, which are all too often weak and "wimpified." I wrote an article about that very topic but am unsure of posting it here.

Regarding banishings, I have had success using the purification ritual to INANNA accompanied by tracing the ARRA sign in the air, although I cannot necessarily recommend this shortcut to others.

This post has been edited by Penny_Lane: Oct 19 2006, 05:59 AM

The Necronomicon approach is more blunt and direct than that of many other magickal systems, which are all too often weak and "wimpified." I wrote an article about that very topic but am unsure of posting it here.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/ac42.gif)


Why are you unsure of posting it here? If it would be an issue of having other magickians whining about it, you could simply attatch it in "Word" to a post rather than posting the text of the document.


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

i would be intrested in hearing your article no matter how blunt or what ever though if its for personal reasons i understand


necronomicon is an odity an intresting... mesopotamia(mes?) is a very intresting subject an very obscure an the necro is a very good answer for that obscurity though i dont think it is accurate in mes magick; i do believe its a very good system i.e. that it deals with gods very ancient an powerfull, the methods are very dark ages...um Grimoirion, course these are just my thoughts an could be completely wrong.

the lbrp/lbrh are more than banishings i say do them every day if not twice for they fortify an perify the self amazing these didnt exist befere the 19-20 centry just goes to show that there are new things that are just as powerfull as the ancient

insanity some are just pron for it to begin with magic doesnt make one insane...though it may provoke it(or reveal it)

THe Necronomicon has many exorcisms which I have found to work excellently in any given situation. As to why Simon says no banishings are effective I believe is total B.S. just to hype the book. Depending on the strength of ones mind will determine whether or not you can banish these forces. That Penny Lane and Suxor Mash have their own sucessful methods of banishing shows that they possess good self esteem and confidence in themselves. There are many ways to get from point A to point B.

AFter all Sorcery is gaining power over the spirits as one gains power over ones self. To say that one can not effectively banish spirits within the Necromoicon is to say that thew system can never be mastered. Which I assure you is complete and total B.S. It is a blind. Do not believe it. What exsist in the mind exsist in reality. So if you believe that b.s. then you will never master the Necronomicon. Reign in that monkey mind. Turn it into the eye of the Tiger. Fearless in its calculations. The only thing that is impossible is that which we believe impossible.


Zi DIngir Enki Kanpa!

This post has been edited by smasher666: Oct 19 2006, 10:31 AM

My reading about the banishing is that the typical banishing rites don't work, not that there are no banishings that work. I don't mean to offend, but there are a lot of mealy-mouthed "systems" out there, that do not take the spirit realm very seriously, and are kind of the "Cosmo" version of magick/ritual. I have no doubt that such methods won't work on Nec entities. Nec entities (indeed, the deities and entities of MOST ancient religions) are to be taken FAR more seriously that the practitioners of "smorgasbord" magick do. indeed, the gods were much feared (as in both fear and reverence) by the worshippers of their time. Nec deities/entities are old, and darn well expect to be respected, and if you try to deal with them on the cutesy hocus-pocus level that you find so many "fashionable' practitioners seem to be at, you'll be seen as a fool, and they'll wipe the spirit world with you.

Smasher666 mentioned in another thread that he has met Ereshkigal and Nergal in his travels and they were quite nice to him. No doubt that he approached them with respect, not some "I command you to give me an 'A' on my philosophy exam' nonsense. The key to contact, and when necessary, banishing of entities seems to not just be confidence in oneself, but also to taking the system, and indeed the entities themselves, seriously..

Hope that wasn't too confused.

Greetings Dark Goddess,

I totally agree the Ceremonial style evocations and banishings are foolish with the Necronomicon. I believe that any given system should be worked completely within that systems guidelines. Borrowing from here or there is border line Chaos magick and from my experiments years ago seemed only to piss off the Necronomicon forces. Calling one of the 50 names within a triangle and demanding in the names of God that he / she does your bidding is a recipe for disaster.

I also agree about respecting the spirits. No matter what diety or spirit is invoked there must be sacrifice. Before you do anything with the Necronomicon always conjure the fire god to light the fire. Then summon Bandar and perform the Agga mass ssaratu sacrifice. Now that we have a nice sacrifice going any spirits we call will be appeased.

I never bother to banish any of the 50 names nor do I bother with any banishing after evocation. I feed my Bandar the Agga Mass Ssaratu every night and instruct him to eat any demon or Malfick that comes within my home. After all this is one of the things Bandar is meant for.

Also I never banish Bandar. The mad arab hints that if you do not the Bandar will become so strong that you will not be able to control him. However Bandar is my friend and he is a very angelic type spirit. I do not wish to completely control him. He has permision to do anything he wants to do or go anywhere he wants to go so long as he does not violate the covenant. SOmething which he would never do anyways.

a lot seem to think these banishings are set in stone to a certian faith they are not an if you break it down to its principle it is adaptable to any thing or any faith for they are a representation of the macro/mircro or the uniting of spirit an flesh the actual banishing was perhaps developed by fear but really what is there to fear but fear it self do you realy think a ritual will actually make them leave(though for it to work it is a healthy aditude) or is it deeper an more directed at self

ah i feel safer now.

Also I never banish Bandar. The mad arab hints that if you do not the Bandar will become so strong that you will not be able to control him. However Bandar is my friend and he is a very angelic type spirit. I do not wish to completely control him. He has permision to do anything he wants to do or go anywhere he wants to go so long as he does not violate the covenant. SOmething which he would never do anyways.

I think the key with the Mad Arab's testimony is that he seems to be coming from a magickian's point of view, rather than a priest's. He's trying to control the watcher, whereas you are making a covenant with him, you give him something he wants/likes (the sacrifice) in return for your protection, other than that, you let him do what he wants, rather than try and control him like a puppet. There's that respect, and that goes a long way.

There us really no need to control Bandar. I sacrifice to him every night. I have found that when I neglect the sacrifice for a space of 3 or 4 days he does begin to feed off of me. However this does not upset me as I know he needs energy to stay in this world. Normally one sacrifice every 28 days would be sufficent if he is banished however as per instructions in the Maklu text never ask him to do anything without a sacrifice. Since I never banish him he requires alot of attention. He is my friend and not my slave. He helps me and I help him. After all that is what friends are for.

Zi Dingir Asaruludu Kanpa!

I think the key with the Mad Arab's testimony is that he seems to be coming from a magickian's point of view, rather than a priest's. He's trying to control the watcher, whereas you are making a covenant with him, you give him something he wants/likes (the sacrifice) in return for your protection, other than that, you let him do what he wants, rather than try and control him like a puppet. There's that respect, and that goes a long way.

Very well said. I have always approached the Necronomicon Deities as a priestess, never as a magician. I feel that the Necronomicon works nicely as a "bible" for a personal relationship with one or more of the Gods (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/ac42.gif)
Why are you unsure of posting it here? If it would be an issue of having other magickians whining about it, you could simply attatch it in "Word" to a post rather than posting the text of the document.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

Thank you for your encouragement (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

My original article needs some work because my bibliographic notes were incomplete and some of my statements were conjectural, but the main point was that many critics of the Necronomicon obviously hadn’t read it, were unfamiliar with Sumerian and Babylonian beliefs, or were motivated by political bias.

Some critics claim, for instance, that the Necronomicon is a hoax because its writer implicitly endorses such practices as war, weaponcraft, meat eating, and temple sex workers and is lukewarm or silent about homosexuality. The fact is that all of these views are consistent with those of the ancient Mesopotamians, so their inclusion in the Necronomicon should be treated as evidence for the Necronomicon's authenticity rather than the opposite, even though these ancient beliefs differ from those of mainstream Wicca or neo-Paganism.

Many critics also betray their personal ignorance by claiming that H. P. Lovecraft “wrote” the Necronomicon, one Urban Dictionary contributor even opining that “Simon” is Lovercraft’s “surname,” ignoring the fact that Lovecraft died in 1937, well before the existence of the A-bomb, the Cold War, the moon landing, or the movie The Exorcist, all of which were mentioned by Simon in his introduction. Several critics at Wikipedia and elsewhere claim that the Deities described in the Necronomicon “have nothing to do with” Sumerian or Babylonian Gods, even though all of the Necronomicon Deities are Sumerian or Babylonian Gods and are described consistently with the ancient beliefs.

In sum, I have observed that much of the criticism leveled against the Simon Necronomicon is based on incorrect information or differences in political or moral beliefs, and that the “evidence” for its being a hoax is itself highly questionable, consisting mainly of conflicting hearsay and rumors about various peoples’ claims of authorship. Despite their pseudo-intellectual posturing, no critic has yet been able to show me sound evidence that the Simon Necronomicon is unworthy of my continued use as a holy book.

This post has been edited by Penny_Lane: Oct 24 2006, 04:56 AM

Penny lane----u could not be anymore right on!!!! Seriously--that is why I have begun to have a sour taste in my mouth towards Ceremonial Magick in general. 9 of 10 of them "experts" have never picked up the Necronomicon and used it w/ a full heart. So to them---BARRA-EDIN NAZZU!

Something I find kind of funny, is many claim the Simon Nec to be a fake. However, these same people, especially CMs, teach that their spells and rituals are personal (hence why each makes his own Book of Shadows/Spellbook/whatever the tradition calls it), i.e. they make it up, and even try to get others to give them their spells. So, by their own definitions, the Simon Nec would be a spellbook written by Simon, and as valid as any of theirs, so, what's the big hubbub about?.

This post has been edited by DarkGoddess: Oct 24 2006, 06:46 PM

@DarkGoddess: good point.

I think, perhaps, because in this field 'older is better' and people try to ascribe ownership/authorship to an ancient authority. For example, the Legemeton in its current form dates from about the 17th century, although some of the component texts are a few hundred years older than that. Was it written in Solomon's time? Highly unlikely...

I figure that if something works, it should be used regardless of its (often dubious) origins. If it doesn't work, don't use it. *shrug*