Lavey, Invocations, And Enochian Options

I was wondering how magickally effective/accurate are the spells/keys given in The Satantic Bible. I was referencing my copy the other day and stumbled upon them again. I was wondering if anyone had any experiences using them?

This post has been edited by Velarius: Oct 1 2008, 07:37 AM

Greetings!
It has been my observation that you can get results with most any spell or ritual if you approach them correctly. Not all such things ARE constructed to work smoothly because said author(s) know little to nothing about the magical mechanics involved. A good book that illustrates some rather basic techniques/formulations used in proper setup of magical formula is Real Magic by Bonewits. Taken with the opposite approach there are books with some very potent formula in them but unless the student takes the time and effort to use the formula correctly then they will still get nothing. This is a hard lesson to all you aspiring mages...Learn the basics. Understand how spells/formula work before casting else you will get results commensurate with your skill level...ie: from nothing up to partial success. Then there are those rare times when everything just seems to fall together seamlessly. Viola! But it is better to know your stuff rather than letting the Fates intervene with unknown results!
I've read and understand alot of LaVeys subject matter and he had tried to superimpose alot of Enochian over his brand of Satanism...which, IMHO, leaves alot to be desired! But I am merely one voice out of many here...Gather you more information and Good Journey to you! Also...we have some specific classes here by competant Mages who can and will help guide you in the uses of our Arte! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

They aren't very accurate (let me explain soon) but I believe one could get some results using them.
I think most impractical part (although optional) is obtaining a nude female to play the part of the altar.

Otherwise there's the setting of mood, purification of space, declaration of intent, invocation of forces etc.

What I meant by inaccurate is the use of Enochian Keys which would clash with invoked forces, and not at all be "evidential of the priest's allegiance" IMHO.
Although the formula looks like it was made by a teenage chaote, I've no doubt it could work...

This post has been edited by Agni: Oct 11 2008, 04:43 AM

They aren't very accurate (let me explain soon) but I believe one could get some results using them.
I think most impractical part (although optional) is obtaining a nude female to play the part of the altar.

Otherwise there's the setting of mood, purification of space, declaration of intent, invocation of forces etc.

What I meant by inaccurate is the use of Enochian Keys which would clash with invoked forces, and not at all be "evidential of the priest's allegiance" IMHO.
Although the formula looks like it was made by a teenage chaote, I've no doubt it could work...

I had a feeling this was the case. I have but experimented with them once or twice and have gotten very little from it so i discontinued the practice. I suppose this could be because that is an area of magick that i am not as experienced in. I have gone back to my traditional golden dawn style rituals which are working increasingly well for me with each passing day.

Athena knows quite a bit about Enochian - I do wonder what her advice would be on this particular matter. I think she and are of the same general opinion when it comes to LaVey, but I don't know if she'd agree with me when I say I don't think LaVey's "Satanic Rituals", Enochian-based or not, are very effective regardless of intent and skill of the person utilizing them.

If LaVey had been proficient in Enochiana and thoroughly versed in Dee/Kelly's system, perhaps they would be useful or even good. But... LaVey... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/haha.gif)

I find the enochian calls included within the satanic bible dreadful and pathetic.

The guy actually took all the enochian calls as they are and tried to change the meaning of the words.

For instance:

"Ol sonuf vaoresaji, gohu IAD Balata" in the enochian system means "I reygn over ye, sayeth the God of Justice".
Now, the meaning that LaVey gives to the "Ol sonuf vaoresaji, gohu IAD Balata" phrase, is:
"I reign over thee, saith the Lord of the Earth"...

And such tremendous misinterpretations keep going on for all the keys. The guy didn't even bother to study enochian in order to find the correct words that give the meaning that he was seeking, all he did was just change the last word some keys and replace it with "Seitan". Let alone that he cut some enochian phrases and in his English translation, the translation of these phrases was in the English text!

This part of his work is so bloody inconsistent and pathetic it gives me severe brain damage!

If you want to mess an enochian call, do it, but at least do it correctly, like Peter Carroll did. I may disagree with Carroll's meaning for the call he created, but at least he used the correct bloody enochian vocabulary.

For all you LaVeyan guys, if you use the keys as given in the satanic bible, you are just invoking forces like Justice, Virtue, high Angelic force, the elements in the name of God, and stuff like that that you would probably avoid, if you knew enochian. This is more like "Oh, God of Justice, help me do this with your power, and oh, angelic forces, help me do that with your presence.. for I am a worshipper of Satan".

It lacks of reason and it is like you are asking to get smacked.

I just want to make clear that I have no problem with any kind of Spell casting, including LaVey's rituals. But since I've been involved with the Enochian system, and I'm trying to get deep with it, I find insulting LaVey's translation and interpretation of the Calls. These forces can function no matter how you use them, an interpretation that I heard quite some time ago is that the Enochian forces are neither good nor evil, they are just the core of the universe.