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Offerings And Sacrifices For The Goetics, what are good options when the book specifies this must be done? |
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altpath |
Mar 5 2007, 02:49 PM
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Zelator
Posts: 205
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From: middle of nowhere (hint: somewhere in LA) Reputation: 2 pts
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I was looking at some of the goetic descriptions in the book, and I started to think to myself "what the hell is a good offering for these guys?".
There are many spirits in the book, Kings, that I'd like to work with down the line but I don't know what proper offerings and sacrifices and gifts are for them.
Do I look in liber 777 and get ideas there, that correspond with solar spirits? Or do I follow some other advice by magicians that have already worked with them? Or do I risk not giving them those offerings and simply evoke them and ask them straight-out what they'd like?
I'm interested in anyone that has experience with any of the kings, like paimon, belial, bael, or beleth. I don't really know many people that have evoked them.
I will try a pendulum with the seals to see if I can get some kind of answer like that, but I usually don't get much out of a pendulum.
Btw, I've not been able to figure out what "the bonds and charms" are. I've asked around, but nobody seems to know. I guess that's something that is just ignored nowadays.
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altpath |
Mar 5 2007, 04:14 PM
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Zelator
Posts: 205
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From: middle of nowhere (hint: somewhere in LA) Reputation: 2 pts
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Thank you for the input, Darkmage (IMG: style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Thinking about your suggestion of alcohol, are there planetary associations with certain types of alcoholic beverages? Like tequila for mars or rum for the sun??? (IMG: style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Or do you mean regular rubbing alcohol? Also, are the offerings burned during the evocation (which is something I did once that helped a lot with manifestation) or are they left until after the license to depart and buried/burned afterwards? Seems to me that burning oranges might help with a solar spirit to manifest but I am just theorizing here.
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Darkmage |
Mar 5 2007, 05:55 PM
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Snarkmeister
Posts: 276
Age: N/A Gender: Female
From: 33N, 112W Reputation: 2 pts
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Rubbing alcohol's great--if you're trying to get rid of them or piss them off. I mean ethyl alcohol, the drinking stuff. I usually pour half a glass of wine or something--basically whatever I have ATM--on the ground where the triangle was before I scrub off the sigil, but that's me.
Incense is easy--either use it to summon them in the triangle or toss it on the fire after they arrive.
What kinds of stuff you offer's up to you. Don't be afraid to ask if an entity has a specific preference--if they do, they'll usually say so. Now, if one only accepts Dom Perignon, he's either yanking your chain or politely declining your request. If that's the case, tell them, 'fine, if that's what you want, give me the $$ to get it for you!' I've never thought that deeply about correspondences and whatnot as they don't hold a great deal of meaning for me.
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As the water grinds the stone, We rise and fall As our ashes turn to dust, We shine like stars... --Covenant, "Bullet"
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altpath |
Mar 5 2007, 11:35 PM
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Zelator
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Hello edunpanna, QUOTE The 68th spirit is called Belial, he is a mighty king and powerfull; he was Created next after Lucifer, & is of his order; he appeareth in ye forme of a Beautiful angel sitting in a Charriot of fire, speaking wth a comly voice, declaring that he fell first & amongst ye worthier & wiser sort wch went before Michael & other heavenly angels; his office is to distribute preferments of senatorships, and to cause favour of friends & foes, he giveth Excellent familiars & governeth 80 Legions of spirits. Note this kink [! king] Belial must have offerings sacrafices & gifts presented to him, by ye Exorcist or else he will not give True answares to his demands; But then he Tarryeth [will tarry] not one hour in ye truth except [unless] he be constrained by devine power & his seal is Thus wch is to be worne as a Lamin, before ye Exorcist &c. This not from the crowley version, it's from the peterson version. I'm sure I've read of others that say this. Anyway, I'm thinking it's just safer to give offerings and "sacrifices" (I don't plan on killing anything, that's for sure (IMG: style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ) even if it's not specified in most cases. Thanks for the tips. I'm not a demon worshipper, but I do like to play it safe, even when it comes to working with a demon (IMG: style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Darkmage |
Mar 7 2007, 12:58 AM
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Snarkmeister
Posts: 276
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From: 33N, 112W Reputation: 2 pts
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I can't speak for anyone else on here, but I treat the reward phase as the dreaded "Please show salary history in cover letter with resume." (IMG: style_emoticons/default/dots.gif) I use what I have on hand at the moment. A lot of incense ingredients aren't hard for me to come by as I live on the edge of the local Chinatown. The Asian grocery near my house has 8oz powdered sandalwood for $5, so I'm stocking up while I can. Spices work, as does food. If they ask "Can't you do better than that?" I point out that I gave them what they asked for, and if they don't like it, it's too damned bad as they're not the boss, I am. If they want a raise they can work to get it. Food works, drink other than alcohol works too (a few have a taste for Coca Cola and Pepsi, actually), incense works, scrawling their sigil as graffitti in airport restrooms works, etc. And as I have said before, just ask them what they want, within reason, and be prepared to give it to them. Be tough though. Make it clear that no work=no goodies and maybe no further summonings/attention. The latter gets their attention right quick, especially if you've worked with that entity for a while. And as with all entities, treat them with respect. Be honest, and be prepared to follow through with either rewards, threats, or a stern lecture as required. These things apply to non-Goetic entities as well, so don't be afraid to take what you've learned with these guys and apply it elsewhere. This post has been edited by Darkmage: Mar 7 2007, 01:02 AM
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As the water grinds the stone, We rise and fall As our ashes turn to dust, We shine like stars... --Covenant, "Bullet"
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Darkmage |
Mar 7 2007, 04:14 AM
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Snarkmeister
Posts: 276
Age: N/A Gender: Female
From: 33N, 112W Reputation: 2 pts
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Wow, you have quite the background. I know we've spoken about it before, but I'm impressed. I stumbled across most of my experience by trial and error. As for the Goetic spirits themselves, I haven't summoned very many (and a couple came to ME under the old "I've got a friend who referred me to you, I've heard you need -- done," but the ones I have summoned have been mainly extremely helpful and quite friendly. I asked Bune for riches once, and he said "It's not your time yet, child. Wait..." and it was a good thing he did. Shortly thereafter everything hit the fan and Marbas came calling as I've explained elsewhere. Marbas isn't a servant, really, to me he's more of a friend. I've never called him formally but I've found I don't need to--I need him, and he comes. All he ever wanted in return was his seal made in glow-in-the-dark plastic. I had the polymer clay, so I made it. It just needs to be fired and hung around one of my stuffed lion's necks per his request. Naberius was friendly, hyperactive, and didn't do what I asked as I found out after the fact that I asked him to do something out of his jurisdiction.
Licence is British. License is American. Since the Goetia was codified long before American English became a standard dialect, this explains the British spellings throughout all the text. Mathers was British (OK, Scottish, but to us Stateside it's all the UK) and so he used standard British spellings in the text.
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As the water grinds the stone, We rise and fall As our ashes turn to dust, We shine like stars... --Covenant, "Bullet"
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altpath |
Mar 7 2007, 10:22 AM
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Zelator
Posts: 205
Age: N/A Gender: Male
From: middle of nowhere (hint: somewhere in LA) Reputation: 2 pts
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Thank you very much edunpanna, darkmage, That's great advice you guys, I really appreciate you've taken the time to help me out. I agree with you edunpanna, I've had very good results with the pentacles of jupiter and of the sun, and anytime I've tried working with any of the goetics for money or anything related to the sun, I get the exact opposite of what I asked for. I like those pentacles very much, and in fact I plan on melting down the appropriate metals to make my own, then evoke the spirits that govern them and ask them to charge them with their essence. For me it's mostly about the danger too. Nothing like fealing alive when you feel like you're gonna die (IMG: style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) I've wanted to get into the necronomicon for a long time, but I can't really get the book from this country in english. It'll have to wait until I go to texas sometime this year. The pdf version doesn't seem to be complete at all, and I prefer holding a book in my hand anyway. If I feel like it's my cup of tea, I'll write out the book someday. Thank you for the great ideas guys!
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