Standards of Living, Goverment plans, benefits, and lack of.. Options

I consider americans as an example, has a good standard of living where the goverment supports it's citizen, unlike many developing countries where beggars, woman and children are still roaming, sleeping in the street, knocking for small changes on your window at most busy traffic lights.

American living isn't all groove and juice. I moved from Canada where the health care system kicks some major butt. Here, It costed me almost $200 for a friggen appointment that resulted in absolutely nothing (I required it for college...ugh). My health care costs for insurance are almost $800 a year, which from what I hear, is wicked cheap. In Canada....it would have costed me maybe $300 annually, and that covers everything. If I wanted to get a prescription, my plan would cover it without having to go through months of paperwork and crap. Here, in America, health care is given to the rich.

Here in America, you have those people who are roaming the streets, sleeping in the streets, begging for change at traffic lights. Everytime I go to Holyoke, there is ALWAYS a guy standing at the intersection by Barnes and Noble begging for money. American government taking care of their citizens?

In Canada, there are a bazillion outreach programs for the homeless. About two years ago, Vancouver starting kicking out the homeless from the city and forced them to come over to Kelowna. For a few months business' where actually shutting down because of the increase in homeless people crowding their front doors. The government set up more shelters, even a few of the churchs started shelters and programs. In about 6 months time, the percentage of homeless went down by at least %50, if not a little more. The Canadian government is putting more emphasis on finding these people jobs, getting them adequate housing, and necassary training to allow them to be self-sufficient. Here, I see nothing of that. I read the paper every day, keep up with the news on news talk radio, and not a single thing is mentioned on helping the homeless. Barely anything is ever mentioned on immigrants either, in regards to helping them. I see something wrong with this, or it could just be me.

Third world countries aren't the only ones lacking in proper government.

As with everything else, I do think it is a good thought to bring unity and peace. But, I also understand that it will never happen. Like what has already been stated, a whole government certainly wouldn't maintain peace, especially if that government was based in religious rootings. One major draw back, is naturally assuming this would ever happen, it would be under the basis of ONE single faith. What if someone decided that that faith was not good for them? What would happen to that person? What would happen to the groups that went with their own paths?

With the education system, as has been mentioned (pardon my lack of rememberance for who it was), finding a teacher who lacks any of those prejudices will be damn near impossible. Finding Anyone who lacks them will be next to be impossible.

Prayer is for those who choose to prayer, not to be forced. Freedom of will and thought and expression.

Turning the military force into a police force? My total lack of understanding of how that would be a good thing prevents me from saying anything at all about it.

Has anyone seen the movie Equillibrium? If not, it's a film about a society that doesn't feel a damn thing. Nothing. A society that doesn't have art, diversity, etc. It's all white and gray, straight walled, perfect organization, one government who controls millions of drones. People who walk the same way, dress the same way, eat the same way, look the same way, everything is done the same friggen way.

How boring, uneducational, dull, and almost revolting. How would that constitute as being good? To not even be yourself is setting you up for being incinerated. Fun.

Disclaimer: I probably worded some things wrong, or missed a few points. Being in a hurry isn't good, lol.

~ Title and description changed to reflect more accurately on topic content. ! Kinjo

This post has been edited by | Kinjo: Sep 21 2005, 07:23 AM

Developed countries still will take care their citizen more than a developing country due to resources available. Most developed countries gave unempoyment benefits, senior benefits, free education etc. Under-developed countries got none of the these benefits for it's citizens and has to pay cash for mostly everything.

That's certainly true enough, but playing the advocate a little more here, there is no such thing as "equal rights" here when it comes to government support. For example, it took my roommate years to get her disability, and when they finally give it, they say "f%*! you, we're taking away over half of it, giving 1/3 of it to your lawyer who sucks ass, and your gonna deal with it". With what they are now gonna give her, she'd be lucky if she can get at least one bill caught up. She has to fight for it, and continuely get kicked in the face.

And then there are the people who are on welfare who don't need to be on it, and the people who do need, don't get it.

Sure, there is some sort of semblance of government support, but it blows, and can almost be considered as if there isn't any in the first place.

Just being the advocate! Wheee!

So called 'under developed' countries are normally being exploited by developed countries. If Fair Trade replaced Free Trade then poor countries could trade themselves out of poverty rather than being reliant on food aid. If wealth was shared more equally then healthcare, education, food etc could all be accessed by the people who need them.

I'm not going to try and convert you to the anti-capitalist point of view, but just look at the problems the world faces and ask yourself of Free Trade has solved problems or caused problems.

The largest problem you'll have with every goverment is inherent. There has never been a goverment in human history in which 100% of the people involved agreed on a form of goverment.
Take our goverment in America, when founded there were still many who were loyal to England, by no means the majority apparently, but there were more than a few. And we've been disagreeing with each other ever since until we've made a system were "ignorance is no excuse for the law" yet there is an entire profession dedicated to the comprehending it, and they don't know all of it, as I recall it runs something like this: a cop is required to know 25%, a lawyer 50% and a judge %75 percent (rough numbers , don't recollect the specifics.)
Utopian society to take care of all is a more than beautiful idea, but the unification of will to see it through has not yet in 40,000 years of human existance to our knowledge come to pass. Also more than that you have to consider that many people care absolutely nothing for there fellow man, and in short sightedness will burn his fellow man for mere amusement. And in modern times record said burning and put it on national telivision to amuse everyone else to.
†Raven†
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sculacciata.gif)

somethings never change it seems. Sad but true. although here in belgium there is a good health plan, when you are unemployed you get payed by the state. When you are injured and unable to work you also get payed by the state.

Perhaps i am lucky to live in utopia..., or perhaps amerika wastes money on the war machine so that its people fail to get the money they need for medication and such ?

Perhaps amerika is much like a third world country, at least the goverment is...

Most people in europe think that the avarage american person is very dumb. i think people are people, but the goverment surely does a louzy job, i say, blaim bush!

This post has been edited by A_Smoking_Fox: Sep 21 2005, 04:02 AM

We live in a plutocracy here in America. The present administration has done more to further this than any other in our history. 12.7% poverty level! I am counted within this group. Our system of rules regulating 'gaining' the Disabled status are rigorous. You are required to pass their criteria of disability, then the government doesn't begin the dole until you've had NO INCOME for 5 months! (Bear in mind that I've worked for well over 30 years and contributed to our Social Security) Try to live on air for 5 months! If you make over a certain amount of money (this is determined by how long and how much you contributed to Social Security) then you are denied food stamps, housing, energy assistance, medical assistance and there just isn't any dental plan. You will be elligable for prescription drug coverage but at a steep cost and I couldn't get Medicare for 2-1/2 years! All this and you get treated as if you are dirt for having a disability. Granted, there are a goodly number of scammers out there that feed off the system but...most of what regulates my section of the economic pie are the fatcat politicians, who never have to worry about the laws they enact! They have their own health plans and retirement plans, untouched by taxes, etc. Hell, if they don't think they make enough, they vote themselves a pay raise! Even if they serve only one term, Senators retire with at least a $100,000/yr salary + full medical coverage until they die! (On disabiliuty I cannot make more than $800/mo income - from any source without losing my disability status...I'd rather work...I made much more working...but what didn't they understand about disability? I'm not allowed to own anything that could be construed as an asset.) Thanks for the rant, I could go on.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

It was stated above that Americans are viewed as being rather dumb...Uh huh! We lead very insular lives. When I was growing up it was during the McCarthy era where everyone was afraid of being labeled a communist or a facist. We are not taught foreign languages in our primary schools but later, in high school and college. We are a very young nation. Lately our political government has been adopting coldwar Russian tactics (KGB/National Security) against the populace. The Fraud that was perpetrated during the last 'election' was staggering! We have the potential to be a very good country but greed has spread too far. China and Japan now own 48% of our national debt. We are becoming a third world power. We live in interesting times!

I don't know if americans are dumb or not. But it is the face america shows for the rest of the world.

I don't think it's true, because i visit these forums and occultforums, and there are lots of smart people around.

There are dumb people everywhere. The USA is enjoying being viewed thusly because of any number of reasons...Bush being one of them. The problem lies with the apparent inability or the lack of interest it would take to get involved in the politics. Frankly, if you aren't rich, you cannot afford to run! As individuals there are many bright, if not brilliant, people in the USA. This Forum and Occultforums are not good cross-sections of Americans. We are a distinct minority.
I've heard that Belgium (as well as other European countries) are rather progressive. I'm heartened!

A major problem with democracy or those involved is that if you are not involved you will be underrepresented. White males are not the majority in this country yet they hold an overwhelming majority of elected positions. The main reason being that as a percentage of the population they dominate the polls! Women are currently the majority yet they vote at a lower rate. The same with other underrepresented areas, minorities, the poor etc. As previous posts state the poverty level is at 12.7% yet people at that level almost never vote or taking any active involvement. The hard and true fact is that no one is going to stand up for you if you can't help them to be elected and hold their position. Bush's election shows this fact. Evangelical Christian did vote in previous elections but their force wasn't felt until his. When you look at the numbers you see a dramatic increase in their numbers. He literally swept the south because of this. My own home town is a perfect example. I live in State College, PA which is the home of Penn State University, one of the nations largest institutions. The students who live here are constantly complaining that the surrounding town does not work with the University on student issues, yet students outnumber residents here nearly 5 to 1. In the last township election only 800 people voted out of a population of 75,000. Only 12 students voted. The election was decided by only 30 votes. Can these complaints really be justified? Non-involvement denies any rights to complain. It's all fine and dandy to beleive that people want to help those that need it but it is merely a pipe dream in the real world. The only thing to create change is power and until underrepresented groups seize that power they will continue to be left in the cold.

Absolutely! You MUST vote in order to change the system. But...when the ballots are rigged and there are people 'fudging' the tally, you get what we have. BTW, students attending college, of voting age, can not vote in area politics because they are not registered in that area. One should always check the voting laws in your area. One is entitled to vote with absentee ballot during federal elections. Local politics which govern the town/city are for registered voters that live there year round.
Bush's party swept the south but not the southern cities. Most red states were represented by big business, wealthy land owners and the religous right. New Orleans voted mostly Democratic which is why some people are suggesting that a slow response was due to political persuasion. I , myself, don't believe that...I think it was money driven.
Interesting note: There has been a HUGE influx of tanker trucks arriving up in Maine carrying water and ice. When questioned by the media, the govn't told the media it's none of your business...go away! The states governor is pissed. No obe knows why this is happening and those that do know aren't talking...

BTW, students attending college, of voting age, can not vote in area politics because they are not registered in that area. One should always check the voting laws in your area. One is entitled to vote with absentee ballot during federal elections. Local politics which govern the town/city are for registered voters that live there year round.

This idea is understood yet most who attend school here also receive mail here. Changing your registration area is as easy as changing your address. And most who attend change their address so that after two years they are eligible to pay state rates for tuition. If you are from in-state you can change your registration along with your address in under 5 minutes. Most don't bother to vote in the area they hold registration (whether it is at school or home) it is a matter of inactivity not being screwed by a loophole in this case. The reason I know this is because this year over 2.000 students have switched registration in the last two years in order to help lead a USG(university student govt.) led coup of the town council. Here is a case where a group has realised it's potential and seized it. Effectivenes of this attempt will be determined in the end of october.

Whether Bush swept the southern cities or not is irrelevant. He won the states, that is all that matters. In fact this idea illustrates my point as these states usually went blue becaue the cities outweighed the other areas. In these elections the non-cities voted at higher rates than normal causing the shift.

"Fudging" the tally is a problem on both sides of the coin. Both parties attempt to rig elections to the best of their abilities. It is one of those unsolvable problems. You can't let the rats guard the cheese. But the action of guarding the cheese makes you a rat from the beginning.

Fact of the matter is that America would be next to nothing if California annexed. California is what America needs, people know too, but they don't want to admit it, they want all 50 states to shine with equal glory without one star being the brightest. Instead what happens is expoloitation, if anyone here is thinking it's expensive to live in America you need to come live in populated California city for a week, where everything costs the extreme. It's worth it of course as it's all groove and juice out here, but it could be so much better if only we weren't getting bilked out of so much money from our fellow states. There's a million other problems of course but as long as California stagnates so will America, history has proven this.



Remember,
California's not a way of life, it's just a place, and this place is a way of life.

This post has been edited by Bb3: Sep 22 2005, 02:09 AM

Fact of the matter is that America would be next to nothing if California annexed. California is what America needs, people know too, but they don't want to admit it, they want all 50 states to shine with equal glory without one star being the brightest.

Do you mean secede? As in California should secede from the union?


chaoscrowley.txt

This post has been edited by chaoscrowley37: Sep 22 2005, 02:28 AM

You know, I like the idea of the Greater Californian Empire annexing the Midwest...why hasn't Philip K. Dick or someone come up with that idea before?

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/00000008.gif)

my bad divide then conquer