Magick Circle?, How was Witchcraft done long ago? Options

One of the things I have always wondered was how was Witchcraft done in the ancient days? Many complain that casting a circle is totally ceremonial magick, and should not be preformed; but then how would the energy be contained? Does anyone have any alternitives to circle casting? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wizard.gif)

What do you consider to be 'ancient times'.

As ancient, I mean in the Greek/Roman times, and possibly Celtic times.

I have never cast a physical circle, for me it is about becoming aware of where your magickal/intended energy begins and ends and mentally affirming the 'edge'.

Your circle is an extension of you, it comes out from your purest, magickally intending self and after use, you draw it back in - I keep mine within my body; that does not mean there is no energy outside of you. You can clean up your chakras and open or close those or draw in spirit/universal energy and let that surround you 'uncharged' - by that I mean as a natural part of yourself. The energy that you use in circle is what I call 'charged' with intention to form a circle' and has a definite boundary and purpose that you set to work in.

This is just what I call things and how I see them, so I hope you understand it, if not, ask someone who is familiar with the language of the system you are interested in (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

What I am saying is that the circle is not tied to being ceremonial or anything else, it is one of the things occultists use to protect themselves in whilst they work.

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Ahhh...I've never really thought about it that way. I have worked with what I call Astral Circles, which is when the circle is entirely in your mind, meaning that you can "cast" it in your mind, not by walking around and and really moving. I do it mostly when I'm in cramped quarters.

The only reason that people move and walk around a circle is because it help to build energy. The more energy you put into your magic/k the more successful it will be.

A good example can be found here...

http://www.sacred-magick.com/forum/index.p...findpost&p=3524

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/ac42.gif)

I second that .... the more the merrier ... the more the better ....!!!!

and on a hoochie note (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) More at a prty is never a bad thing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tease.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/uglyhammer.gif)

Depending on what I'm trying to accomplish I probably wouldn't cast a circle. Only if I thught that unwanted energies could influence my work or if casting a circle had significant meaning and purpose for my work would I cast a protective circle. But in general most people probably use their magick within a fairly comfortable area. Like their homes or somewhere familiar. In places like that something you might want to be protected from pobably won't have enough of a connection to you to do any harm anyways. I usually just center myself in my room or living room, basement yard where ever by just walking the perimeter and touching things so I can get "familiar" with whats around me on a psychic level.

Acid, dont forget that whenever you do magick you are a beacon for not only the good energies and entitities that will help you achieve your goal, but for the negative energies and entities as well. Its these negative energies that we use a circle for. Not to mention that a circle/bubble also help hold the energy in so it combines and gets more focused before release into the cosmos...

Spellcasting in general is a form of magick that generally doesnt require a circle or bubble. The same with candle magick.

However, in my training, Ceremonial Magick Does. Whether its a circle cast by physical ritual or by astral ritual or out of habit, it doesnt matter. That fact that does matter is that its there with anything you do ritualistically speaking... Remember "as above, so below." While you are performing your ritual in the physical plane, You are also, or should also be performing it in the astral.

You mentioned ancient times, well stone circles were often used from what we can tell (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Circles work well for focusing energies to one area, however a whole room dedicated to the work is good for that as well.
Personal preferance probably.
Maybe try working with a circle, and without, then note the difference and decide. I find physical circles to work the best.
Athena

You're right babalon enegies do gravitate to the caster. However in my experince the more familiar one is with an area the more intuned one is with the energies of that spot. This makes a "comfort zone" and that tends to repell the negative stuff except the negative stuff that's internal- within the magician. Like a nomad isn't well defended from animals, rivals and the elements but a baron of a castle is much more protected, so long as he remains within that comfort zone. So my living space is in effect a permanent bubble of protection. I need only reaffirm this from time to time. Kinda like replacing old bricks on a castle wall. If, however, the magician was attempting to complete cerimonial magick (kinda like opening the gate to allow a messenger or guest enterance) as in summon or create spirits, god forms, familiars, thought forms, other such entities I would be sure to not only cast a circle but make sure I had done any required purification, centering and grounding before even attempting to complete the ritual. Like this: The keep of a castle is the magician. The castle wall is his psychic barrier. Turrets can be any summoned watch towers, the gate and draw bridge are the magician's connection between the mirco cosom and the macro. The mote is the protective circle that makes sure all energies are gathered at one point- the gate. And only the desired ones may travel through the magician's gate. The turrets and murder holes at and around the gate defend the keep from the other unwanted guests.

But as general guide lines before doing cerimonial magick I follow this order of basic rituals meant to build the castle wall, turrets, murder holes and mote, to protect the keep and its king- me:
First ground to connect with earthly energies, then center to balance my psychic body within the setting I am in, then purify myself to make sure all negative influences are disppelled and won't "ride" with me once I cast a circle. This seems to work best for me. I have tried to mix and match between the three but if I attempted to purify myself before being grounded the purification wasn't effective. If I tried to purify before centering myself my surroundings seemed to prevent any purification. If I tried to center myself before grounding I couldn't find balance. So the order of ground, center, purify, cast circle, complete ritual (both preliminairies and actual rite) then close the circle, purify, re-center, ground (as in let earthy energies return) and continue with my life.

This is pretty much for cerimonial magick. In the case things like certain pathworking rituals, lucid dreaming, astral protection, trace work, general meditation or visualization I need only to be familiar with my surrounding area. No circle is nesseccary for it already exists. The castle is already built and needs only to be maintained.

I have quarreled with myself over this and studied and restudied different versions of the paths i practice.
I am a Ceremonial Magician too but i woul have to say that what makes Ceremonial Magick Ceremonial is...well, Ceremony, not the Circle.

The protective Circle is a very Babylonian/Semitic idea even if its not uncommon in other cultures.
Besides, ones worldview/Mystical system also decides much in whether one needs protection or not (that extensively).

I can very well imagine a Lodge or Temple like setting where the "furniture" is used for clearing and invocing the powers and the walls act as "Circle".

Many Druids does not use a Circle but call Land, Sea and Sky as part of their Cosmology.
Sometimes they have a boundry of some sort but focus the energies by will.

In Pecti Wita (a Scottish Wicca Tradition) one simply centers oneself.

In Voudoun/Santeria/Macumba i can imagine the lord of the crossroads or door opener Legba/Elegua/Exu is enough to trigger an "opening" between the worlds effect.

Or the crossroads themselves (helped by Cosmology) help the feeling of energy.

One has to remember,in both Druidism and Asatru there is a world tree seen as the Axis Mundi (center of universe) the pillar in the middle of the Houmfour, the Ponton Mitain fills the same role in Voudoun.
In other words, the practitioner is already at the center of the universe.

The Egyptian took on Godforms (if in the Golden Dawn sence, who knows?).
I can imagine that from a view of being a God you can also contain the energies around you pertaining to that God.

The Norse Vitki and Seidar sat on skins or platforms above "creation".

We should also remember Wei Dan Qi Gong, affecting Chi outside the person himself.

The Circle most comonly used (with some variations) is a Golden Dawn thing and the Elements called are Neo Platonic.

Ofcourse there are a number of ways of calling and holding energies.
Finding them out is another thing entirerly.
Also, we must ask ourselves "what constitutes a Circle?".

I read somwhere (regarding the Celts) that they would have like permanent magick circles, where they could like cut doorways and such to get in and out. The W****n practice of doing things with their "atame" maybe where they got this from.

Regarding the Romans/Greeks, did they really do magick?? I thought they just went to the temple of the god they were praying to and prayed. With witchcraft we dont have permanent circles (usually. They guy on WitchDoctor Joes RaddleBone podcast stores his circle in is navel area.) And we definitly dont have central temples to worship in. How would solitaries worship?