Longevity Options

is anyone here actively seeking longevity or any kind of psuedo-physical immortality? if anyone is, im curious as to what you may have found out about it or what is useful.

As of right now, experimental science is trying to do just that. Mostly, this idea appeals to the post-humanist movement. More details can be found at www.hplusmagazine.com

That place does well in terms of appealing to that crowd.

i dont know that i am post-humanist. though i am appreciative of what science may do in the future, i was talking more of magically extending life. anyway, thanks for the reply.

Another alternative is to look into Tai Chi or Qigong. A lot of eastern-style exercise focuses on vitality and long life.

Keep your eyes and ears open, more importantly an open mind. Fuse science and magick where you can for the best results.

Another perspective to look at is one's attitude. A friend once said, "People die when they have nothing more to learn from this life, this human experience on earth." So, by that token, one's love of learning could extend one's life, as their will forces them to live longer for the sake of looking for an enriching experience.

hi xenomancer


on a science level, im aware that the use of certain brainwave technologies may be beneficial in this search.

on a magical level, im aware of certain digestive techniques, both of real food as well as astral and/or light radiations.

when one has succeeded in healing themself by way of the divine, it could dawn on some that the techniques used might also be used as a type of preventetive medicine. so for those of you who have a handle on self-healing methods you may want to consider the possibility of such a thing.

i know a lot of taoist traditions focus on longevity, i have one book on it, but havent looked extensivly into it.

learning is good, ive actually been more inspired reading these forums the last few days than i have been in a while, a lot of well thought people here, the things said have actually brought a lot to the surface for me.

in the clear light

Igisi

I heard fasting extends your life. Your body learns naturally how to conserve energy and your metabolism slows, which means your cells divide slower and you age slower.

It is a pity that life is so short. I do not agree with the too-popular sentiment that we ought to make way for new generations, or that we become over-burdened by unhappy memories. Plenty of fine enterprises and promising careers are cut short by injury and disease, but aside from these we are severely limited by aging. As the Psalm says, we gain nothing more by living to 80 years instead of 70 except sorrow and toil, but even this is too short.

The most promising anti-aging work being done in the medical industry is also focused on disease remedies, and that is the field of regenerative medicine, otherwise known as "tissue cloning." This technology exists, though it has been unfortunately overshadowed by the absurdity of whole organism cloning and the indefensible outcry against stem cell research. The same people who permit legal abortions also ban stem cell research... go figure. At any rate, the idea is that defective tissues are replaced using cloned healthy cells derived from the same organism, so that you could remain in tip-top condition indefinitely.

Nanotechnology has vastly increased the possibilities of tissue cloning, though again the research is stymied by overwhelming public misunderstanding. In these subjects there is solid research being conducted by the top minds in the field and in the best facilities possible. Why is it never given due publicity? I don't know, but the octogenarian PhD who declared "there is no longer any reason to die of old age" was murdered the very next day.

Those who like sane and rational answers can stop reading now.

My own investigations by occult means have nothing whatsoever to do with the scientific ideas above (which are probably a much better bet for longevity), but indicate that it is possible to form a symbiotic relationship with microorganisms and thereby extend life. These were not specifically identified, but it appears to be a species of diatom or crystalline algae (found in Wyoming and elsewhere) that becomes parasitic. These are supposed to exist in water and soil, form similar relationships with plants and tree roots, and may have some bearing on the concept of Ponce DeLeon's mythic fountain. Maybe someday I'll go to Wyoming and try to produce 20 year old hamsters.

I remember a story about a man in China who was documented to have lived 300 years, and attributed it to his herb garden. The Chinese government moved him from the area to have him assist in herbal concoctions, whereupon he died despite an identical diet of identical herbs. I suggest that his secret was not the herbs, but (unknown to him) these crystalline parasites in the water which he had given to those herbs.

I do find that my Qigong practice has strengthened my immune system or constitution. The last time I actually caught an illness was 1994. Many, although not all Taiji or Qigong masters, have lived long lives. There are legends of people living hundreds of years, but they seem to be just legends.

Have you seen the work of Aubrey de Grey? He is working on the fringes of mainstream science but what he proposes is really quite reasonable, i.e. the first human beings to live to 1000 years are alive now, there is no one treatment that can extend life that long that will be developed over the next 30-40 years, but very likely one that will extend life a few decades. This will continue over the next few hundred years assuming no civilization doesn't collapse or technological regression, and people who keep up with new treatments will very likely live to be a thousand.

is anyone here actively seeking longevity or any kind of psuedo-physical immortality? if anyone is, im curious as to what you may have found out about it or what is useful.

Hello, my field of interest is energy work and the like(I guess it has manny elements of all past interests such as reiki, ceremonial magick and resembles in part psychic workings, though i am for the last 4 to 6 years mainely concentrated on energy work since it gave best and quickest results).

I am quite interested in eternal life, hehe as most of humanity in reality(hence the fascination with vampire fiction and movies xD in my opinion at least) and anyone who isnt is just excepting their limitations as they are, and have invested some time in researching it(energy wise). Must say that theories i have in abundance and some tests with more original idea's though i must say i am not sure i am even close to a 100% solution. I guess we wouldnt know, would we? unless i care to step infront of a moving truck which i would prefer not to hehe... Over the years(and im not that old mind you only turning 23 next month) i have thought a lot about what immortality could mean and of course my view of the world and pool of expirience did change and grow quite a bit since then. Im sure there is a way, anything can be achieved and done if you know the way to do it. Question is what form of immortality is even possible? I mean even now we have(some of us) the tools to extend our health and youthfull appearence(and yes i mean magick wise and not the obvious mask of makeup and eating right+exercise) but it doesnt mean we live forever or that we cannot die if someone cuts our head off or if we get a life threatening desease that we dont know how to fix... so you see? a lot can allready be achieved but i guess if only we were all millionares with only our main interests at hand to worry about we could hurry up and get a 100% answer to the next steps and the bigger picture. I guess all i have for now is a bunch of theories(that keep growing+some basic application techniques) and patiance. xD I guess you are a bit dissapointed after reading everyones repli'es(including mine XDDD) but what can you expect?

Regarding the theories i would like it to be "ill show you mine and youll show me yours" type of deal just so i get some more out of this conversation other then answering a question and putting my views on display. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

So anyway, manny thoughts about this came to mind. When i was little and just started this whole thing, vampirism did seem the obvious suggestion to an idea that might be done(at least the idea behind it of adding the life source of others to your own to extend yours, which can be easily taken from others). Thing is that life force can only be taken in rather small daily ammounts(which we all replanish ourselves with daily), which i guess isnt that helpfull is it? but go figure. Other ideas like if your will and energy system becomes stronger and energy reserves become bigger so will your health expend(sorry for a lack of better words this isnt my native language) and your life as a result, which basicaly translates in my mind to "keep doing what your doing and hope for the best" xDDD which isnt much of an instant reassurance for the rest of my life(be it eternal or not) which basicaly is what we are all looking for while searching for these things. Later came the idea of perheps changing your energetic structure and vibration into a form that could trigger phisical change to support eternal life(the most recent idea from about two years ago) but then of course came the wall of "change into what?" without permenantly damaging yourself\and\or disfiguring yourself into something horrific in the process. Also like someone allready said, which again is not a 100% reassurance, you can apply healing techniques to prevent illness and to extend your life, but(!) i would like to add to that the application of keeping yourself looking youthfull and making those small adjustments with some body and mind(through subconcious translation between the two) work and use of proper energy channaling within yourself to make those adjustments over time.

So to cut things short i hope those ideas amused you xDDD as much as they did myself a while back. Other then that my ultimate conclusion is patiance, since with every new piece of understanding\expirience that i uncover my full view of the world enhances and so do my opinions and solutions to situations. So what i am only guessing at at the momment could have a simple answer to what i just couldnt consider because my "full picture of things" was'nt yet full enough. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) So we can work at theories endlessly and around the clock but they are only theories because there is a piece missing in that picture to make it a fact(which is a full understanding and not the result of course which can be achieved if we just had that).

Hope this helps and i got my idea through fully with all my typo's xD and odd sentances. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/13.gif)

This post has been edited by Shimi: Feb 17 2010, 05:22 PM

I heard fasting extends your life. Your body learns naturally how to conserve energy and your metabolism slows, which means your cells divide slower and you age slower.

Science seems to disagree.

It is a pity that life is so short. I do not agree with the too-popular sentiment that we ought to make way for new generations, or that we become over-burdened by unhappy memories. Plenty of fine enterprises and promising careers are cut short by injury and disease, but aside from these we are severely limited by aging. As the Psalm says, we gain nothing more by living to 80 years instead of 70 except sorrow and toil, but even this is too short.

The most promising anti-aging work being done in the medical industry is also focused on disease remedies, and that is the field of regenerative medicine, otherwise known as "tissue cloning." This technology exists, though it has been unfortunately overshadowed by the absurdity of whole organism cloning and the indefensible outcry against stem cell research. The same people who permit legal abortions also ban stem cell research... go figure. At any rate, the idea is that defective tissues are replaced using cloned healthy cells derived from the same organism, so that you could remain in tip-top condition indefinitely.

Nanotechnology has vastly increased the possibilities of tissue cloning, though again the research is stymied by overwhelming public misunderstanding. In these subjects there is solid research being conducted by the top minds in the field and in the best facilities possible. Why is it never given due publicity? I don't know, but the octogenarian PhD who declared "there is no longer any reason to die of old age" was murdered the very next day.

Those who like sane and rational answers can stop reading now.

My own investigations by occult means have nothing whatsoever to do with the scientific ideas above (which are probably a much better bet for longevity), but indicate that it is possible to form a symbiotic relationship with microorganisms and thereby extend life. These were not specifically identified, but it appears to be a species of diatom or crystalline algae (found in Wyoming and elsewhere) that becomes parasitic. These are supposed to exist in water and soil, form similar relationships with plants and tree roots, and may have some bearing on the concept of Ponce DeLeon's mythic fountain. Maybe someday I'll go to Wyoming and try to produce 20 year old hamsters.

I remember a story about a man in China who was documented to have lived 300 years, and attributed it to his herb garden. The Chinese government moved him from the area to have him assist in herbal concoctions, whereupon he died despite an identical diet of identical herbs. I suggest that his secret was not the herbs, but (unknown to him) these crystalline parasites in the water which he had given to those herbs.

The comment about the researcher dieing doesn't surprise me in the least. But at the same time immortality could/ and almost definitely would have drastically negative consequences on this, already over populated, world. This is from a biological standpoint of course.

Science seems to disagree.
The comment about the researcher dieing doesn't surprise me in the least. But at the same time immortality could/ and almost definitely would have drastically negative consequences on this, already over populated, world. This is from a biological standpoint of course.

Oh, that was scientific.

Life extension is a constituent field under the transhumanist umbrella, and one that doesn't seem as creepy as some of the h+ stuff. It's primarily oriented around hormone and supplement levels, which - when attended to from the perspective of longevity - essentially grind the aging process to a halt on the cellular level. There are plenty of mitigating factors, of course, but the science stands up.

This is magickal and/or spiritual enough; after all, nourishment on the physical plane translates to spiritual nourishment.

But at the same time immortality could/ and almost definitely would have drastically negative consequences on this, already over populated, world. This is from a biological standpoint of course.

I'm all in favor of immortality, but have no great desire to extend that privilege to everyone. If I found a proven solution to the aging problem, you can bet I'd tell people, but wouldn't be terribly disappointed when nobody listens.

Please explain what you mean about the "biological standpoint." I don't see any inherent biological problems resulting from exessively long life, other than perhaps a need to revive the immune system periodically to acclimate the body to new diseases.

Overpopulation is a politically-correct way to defend greed or laziness. There are more than enough of necessary resources to meet the needs of hundreds of times the current number of planetary occupants, and enough room too. The dilemmas ascribed to overpopulation amount to problems in resource distribution and occasionally controlled scarcity to retain the value of those resources.

Having dipped into the restaurant business, I can say with absolute certainty that there is an enormous and terrible food waste in every civilized nation. For example, a sandwich shop needs to present "fresh sandwich ingredients" to every customer, yet rarely does everything in stock get sold. You are left with waste that cannot be legally sold or redistributed, and unless you want a massive legal liability you cannot even give it away for free. Yet you cannot serve old food, so you toss it and buy new food stock. You can't lower prices because you are only going to get so-much business in a day and you have expenses to meet. The problem is even worse for grocery stores, especially in the vegetabe departments. What could have fed thousands of people instead feeds dozens.

The same sort of problem exists for other resources and necessities. There is plenty to go around, and to spare, but it is not economically feasible to get the stuff to the people who need it. The problems of overpopulation are political problems, not biological problems. If immortality were limited to those daring enough to eat pond scum or some weird herb, it isn't even a political problem, and there isn't much of an argument against its negative consequences except perhaps for the individual.

Remember also that the ordinary person has at least 20 years of reproductive possibility, yet hardly anyone has more than a handful of children. There are a few exceptions, but these do not offset even local populations significantly. I cannot imagine that a person would suddenly want to have hundreds of children running around. Women produce a limited number of eggs, and it is likely that living longer would not produce more egg cells. If everyone were to become suddenly immortal, you'd probably end up with a society where no one is able to have more children at all after 50 years or so, which to me is a far worse prediction than overpopulation.

Exercise and good health are key to living longer but both ultimately contribute to the aging process rather than stop it out right. Aging is is the process by which the cells in the body lose their ability to reproduce and organs stop functioning gradually over time. If you could find some sort of genetherapy or some mechanism to rejuvenate the cells of the body you could potentially life forever, barring that you die from something other than aging. I think true immortality is physically impossible. Over time everything on an atomic level breaks down into different elements. This decay may take billions of years in some cases but no matter what one does they will eventually cease to exist in their current state of physical existance.

As far as spiritual immortality I think that is the goal of most major religions - To trancsend this physical world into some sort of endless state of bliss in harmony that never ends. But mainstream science doesn't say much about the spiritual aspects of longevity and those that do are usually debunked and branded as hacks.

I also agree that logevity is not something that everybody should be given. I mean think if everybody lived even just 3 or 4 centuries. Think we have a health care problem now? On the other hand as we advance technologically, we shouldn't set up systems that pick and choose who can and cannot be given longevity treatments. What I mean is as long as we have the food, water, shelter and energy to sustain a population I think it would be appalling to have a system that picks who lives and who dies. But if we ever develop singularity or quantum reactors and develop endless food and water and can sustain a habitable climate on this world or abroad, I think living even just 500 years would be pretty cool. So in the mean time I plan to have myself cryogenically frozen until such a world exists cause I am planning on living forever! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)